New Firmware

Originally Posted by Corpulent One

Android runs on hundreds of different hardware configurations produced by dozens of manufacturers, while iOS only runs on two produced by one. The situations really aren't comparable. And of course, for those devices whose manufacturers cultivate an independent developer community, users can, quite literally, install their own updates.
......

Thank you Corpulent One, I know you always have good insight and it is much appreciated. I guess there is a trade-off if one joins the Apple ecosystem. Although I will add that developing for iOS is extremely easy as well (it's so easy that I can do it). I would add that I use my eDGe's every day at work and at home, and appreciate their innate function running Android 1.6 (as I have said before in these forums). I am one of those people who like updated software, and now realize that using Android puts one at the mercy of the companies just as Windows phones did to me in the past. Combine that with the "promise" of an update from Entourage while at the same time providing precious little information, exponentially increases my frustration.

I will disagree about Apple corporate ego, however. The company was on the brink of being demolished and became one of the finest and most admired companies in the world, not by luck or ego, but by providing what customers want. The marketplace has spoken. Thats not ego, its just fact.

While I'm definitely a free market supporter, I don't think the market is a perfect arbiter of quality and accomplishment. Buyers behave irrationally, and in the case of Apple many purchasers are seeking the symbolism and perceived status of the gnawed fruit logo. You can't seriously tell me that the iPod was worth double or triple the price of equivalent MP3 players from other brands, but people buy them at that price.

One could make a pretty good case that the iPad really does satisfy a need that Android tabs thus far haven't, that is, a device that works reliably and does everything the dilettante user could possibly want...but it was the money Apple made on earlier products that were pure image, that enabled them to get so far ahead in the tablet race and according to recent reports lock up 60% of the touchscreens being manufactured worldwide. Even relatively big players in the electronics market like Moto and Samsung have a hard time getting a foothold against that kind of domination, forget about Entourage, Archos, and Viewsonic.

[Posted from my Mac Mini :\ ]

I will disagree about Apple corporate ego, however. The company was on the brink of being demolished and became one of the finest and most admired companies in the world, not by luck or ego, but by providing what customers want. The marketplace has spoken. Thats not ego, its just fact.

... and BRILLIANT marketing. Apple found the 'cord' that resonated with the buyer... and that's about ego. It's always about ego in marketing, isnt't it?

Buyers behave irrationally, and in the case of Apple many purchasers are seeking the symbolism and perceived status of the gnawed fruit logo. You can't seriously tell me that the iPod was worth double or triple the price of equivalent MP3 players from other brands,

...but that's part of the brilliant marketing. You spoke of ego... Apple directed the marketing to the 'buyer's' ego. It's not about Apple, it's about making the buyer think that's the deal... so it's about appealing to the buyer's ego.

...but it was the money Apple made on earlier products that were pure image, that enabled them to get so far ahead in the tablet race and according to recent reports lock up 60% of the touchscreens being manufactured worldwide.

...and isn't that about the buyer's ego, too?

... so in the end it comes down to BRILLIANT, BRILLIANT marketing... and I don't think anyone can deny it.

Originally Posted by aidren

... It's not about Apple, it's about making the buyer think that's the deal... so it's about appealing to the buyer's ego........

I must say that I agree with what you said. The big thing is Apple's ability to know and/or define what people want. It is the same as what Henry Ford said "If I had asked the people what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse". One of my favorite quotes. So Jobs & Company dont ask what we want, they tell us what we want and many people (including me) go along. Brilliant marketing. In any case, All this bashing is just jealousy if you ask me. And I'd prefer to dal with iOS upgrades than anything else. At least we get them. I have a feeling that no one will ever see an upgrade on an Android phone. I am strongly doubting that we will ever see Froyo on the eDGe as well, and am content to use it as is.

Originally Posted by lobotom1

For me the good points were :
- Good PDF handling : Compared to these three devices above, the EE seems to add functionalities while playing with PDF.

I think we all agree, unless you really want all the functions of a tablet PC (in which case you should get a tablet PC), you're not going to find an e-ink device right now that handles pdf better than the edge. If pdf is a main point for you, more important than say the free world-wide 3G connectivity of the Kindle, then yes, I would think the right choice would be the edge.

Originally Posted by lobotom1

- Lack of precise information about what is going on : which means for me a company that don't care of their customers ...

This is the problem I have with new people coming into the forum and seeing us current users airing our own "dirty laundry" and getting only a partial picture of what's happening. While it's absolutely true we haven't been told much of anything about where the device is going, it's important that potential users know that
(a) the device is quite functional right now, and depending on your needs, this may be the best device on your market for your purposes
(b) customer service (not internet presence, not PR, not marketing) has consistently impressed and gone above and beyond to make sure you have a working product in your hands. Can we please not equate "we don't know what the future of this device holds" with a blanket "Entourage doesn't care about it's customers." If you have a problem with your machine, they will fix it, and generally do so quite quickly. I just think it's simply unfair to make a sweeping conclusion like that. Let's stick to specifically what they do and don't do for their customers, and let people judge whether that kind of "caring about customers" is good enough for themselves. While a key group here are very frustrated about future development, or potential lack thereof, the vast majority of people will only ever interact with the company for purchasing and perhaps maintenance issues. Those outside of the US can provide extra perspective on their additional difficulties in getting support, as we have seen differences in experiences depending on where you live. But until we see evidence that customer support is no longer managing expectations, can we please be clear that we have very few cases of people not receiving the maintenance/troubleshooting help they need?

Originally Posted by lobotom1

- YOU CAN'T HAVE A LANDSCAPE PAGE on the E-reader screen without manipulating PDF files on your computer first ...

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't think any pdf-annotating e-reader using e-ink did this yet? I know it *just* (this last week) came to the Asus Eee Note, but again, that's not e-ink. That doesn't mean it's still not a "Con", but again I wonder whether the fact that we keep harping on that point again and again on the board makes it sounds like an inherent weakness when it really is a feature that you can't get anywhere.

Originally Posted by lobotom1

I am really stuck and don't know what to do anymore

I'm all for people gathering information to make an informed decision, but when it paralyzes them it really is a counterproductive activity. Do you need a device like this? If it never did anything more than what it did now, would you pay the asking price for a couple of years of good use? (if we get an update to android 2.x, then I would tack another year onto it)

Don't get me wrong; I understand the frustration. That's one reason I'm now out of the tablet PC laptop market: there simply isn't an "A" machine, and I'm not sure there ever will be. There are some B's and B+'s, but the category as a whole just never quite got there. I think potential edge owners might do well to realize that we're in the same situation here at the moment with the current e-reader/writer market. (Although, I hope to see the market get much better.) Just as "laptops" developed leaving "tablet PCs" as a niche offering for very specific users, e-readers and tablets have been developing, but we have yet to see whether the e-writer category will take off.

Originally Posted by lobotom1

PS : Sarah11918 pay attention the non-blacklit lcd of the Asus EEE 800 seems to have some issues with ambiant light. Hope you have seen it, otherwise I can try to find the videos of this matter that I checked while searching for a good device two weeks ago ...

Thanks for this. I follow this product on a few forums and have seen dozens of videos (unboxings, reviews) and no one that I've come across has mentioned this issue. What are the "issues" to which you're referring? I've heard the display might appear a bit washed out, but I've never heard that the display was a major con. And, just FYI, if I get this it would be just "for fun" as a second device, not to replace the edge. So again, it doesn't need to be perfect. I just like anything that can be used as an electronic note pad, and have a weakness for handwriting-tablet gadgets.

One of the things holding me back from that device is that it's not a "pdf-based" machine like the edge is. Journal notes are in a particular format that can be printed in a graphic format, but not saved/exported as pdf, or else can be shared through a built-in Evernote compatibility (which I still haven't gotten around to using). So again, the edge wins for it's pdf-ness. I want to be able to access the notes I take in pdf form so that I can use pdf editing software or Xournal-type software on any machine I happen to be on. I have a mac program that works like Windows Journal Note for tablet PCs, and my linux tablet has Xournal. Even if those programs only open pdfs as background images on which you can write, at least it's a way to go from one machine to the other. The Asus might be cheap enough to take for a spin and add to my collection, and be more portable, but I don't get the sense it comes close to what the edge does on its e-ink side alone. Just because I'm keeping my eye on it doesn't mean I think it's a comparable replacement.

Sarah,

Thanks for taking your time answering to my thoughts with such seriousness. I must admit I agree with your view on the EE and I am please to clearly learn Entourage is a serious company in term of pure customer support. That is relief.

For the Asus EEE 800, I read a few "reviews" from italian guys as the product is available there and it seems it is delicate to use the device indoor with specific lighting source and aslo when the ambiant lighting of the room is poor.
I got a confirmation of this in two videos on youtube like this one : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akPodZdkqQ0 . As you will see the lightning conditions are very specific !!!
As from now there is only a "minority" of sources that talk about the issue on this device. This seems to be quite similar to the pixel-qi screens like the Notion-ink Adam tablet.

If you don't plan to use it for reading in bed with a poor small table light like me you should be fine.

Laurent.

Merci, Laurent. I'll check out the videos. Lighting isn't a huge deal for me. I'm more interested in it as a note-taking device than a reader, so the screen is less of a concern. Although I know some people do have the device already, it has yet to be released in North America and I have yet to see if it will be at the price point that has been speculated. I'm in no rush to get one, simply curious at this point.

And good luck with your decision in purchasing an edge. Do you have a store near you where you can see one in person? It's such a unique device that many people either love or hate it, and I can appreciate that it's really difficult to know ahead of time into which group you'll fall.

We honestly don't know whether or not to expect a new hardware device or software upgrade or some other announcement altogether soon, so no one can really tell you that it is or isn't a good time to buy. But what we do know is that if you buy now, you'll get the machine we all have, with a known set of features and limitations. I think you'll just have to decide whether you can live with that.

Originally Posted by sarah11918

Merci, Laurent. I'll check out the videos. Lighting isn't a huge deal for me. I'm more interested in it as a note-taking device than a reader, so the screen is less of a concern. Although I know some people do have the device already, it has yet to be released in North America and I have yet to see if it will be at the price point that has been speculated. I'm in no rush to get one, simply curious at this point.

I've been following news of this device pretty closely as well, and haven't seen any complaints about the display. I also was under the impression that the price for North American had been publicly announced at "sub-$200," which in retail speak means $199.99... I suppose that's not a guarantee, although they'd have an awful lot of egg on their face if they released it for more after so much pricing publicity. Anyway, I'm hoping they stick to the April release!

http://tablets-planet.com/2011/02/26...-for-students/
http://www.slashgear.com/asus-eee-no...ntly-25136136/
http://campuslife.asus.com/news/index/117
http://www.tcmagazine.com/tcm/news/h...-200-price-tag

Originally Posted by sarah11918

.... my linux tablet has Xournal.

Oh, what linux tablet do you have?

Originally Posted by Glow

Oh, what linux tablet do you have?

Oh sure, the first post I don't mention the N810 by name thinking everyone is probably tired of hearing of it, you ask me what it is! :P

http://www.amazon.com/Nokia-N810-Por.../dp/B000Y4AH3C

Originally Posted by sarah11918

Oh sure, the first post I don't mention the N810 by name thinking everyone is probably tired of hearing of it, you ask me what it is! :P

http://www.amazon.com/Nokia-N810-Por.../dp/B000Y4AH3C

Ha ha, sorry, I should have noticed that earlier!

Originally Posted by Corpulent One

While I'm definitely a free market supporter, I don't think the market is a perfect arbiter of quality and accomplishment. Buyers behave irrationally, and in the case of Apple many purchasers are seeking the symbolism and perceived status of the gnawed fruit logo.[Posted from my Mac Mini :\ ]

And the market certainly isn't nonpartisan or unbiased. Positive coverage from the media, mainstream or otherwise, can make or break a product. The technology section of The New York Times--an arbiter of what's hot or not for the moneyed set--reads like an Apple press release factory. Their stories are often so biased in favor of Apple, often being outright factually incorrect, or certianly ignorant of all the relevant facts, that I sometimes wonder if Steve Jobs wrote and approved the copy before it was printed/posted.

Then again, maybe it's "magic."

Originally Posted by NiaTrue

.....Their stories are often so biased in favor of Apple, often being outright factually incorrect, or certianly ignorant of all the relevant facts...."

It would be great if you supplied some examples of story elements that are "factually incorrect". If you have such examples, have you tried to report the errors to the NY Times? I suspect they would be receptive to such corrections.

Why bother trying to correct the NYT? they are too busy selling the story they want to sell, rather than telling it like it is. It also wouldn't surprise me if all these outlets were on the take, as they barely even talk about technology unless Apple is involved, and only for positive reasons.

Just look at the lashing Consumer Reports got by the media for telling the truth about Apple's flagship product.

However, it is always hilarious listening to the main stream media talk about technology, the sheer ignorance and inaccuracies are truly astounding.

Originally Posted by alefor

If you have such examples, have you tried to report the errors to the NY Times? I suspect they would be receptive to such corrections.

Yeah, and run them on page W-55 with all the other corrections to front page articles.

I should add that I don't read the NYT so I have no idea how they write about Apple products, but I wouldn't be surprised if NiaTrue's statement is true.