Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > Miscellaneous > Lounge

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-16-2010, 02:26 PM   #16
dsvick
Wizard
dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
dsvick's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,737
Karma: 635747
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast Ohio, USA
Device: PRS-900
Do the prisoners know in what order the other prisoners, and colors, were added?
dsvick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 03:18 PM   #17
omk3
Wizard
omk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five words
 
omk3's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,454
Karma: 37243
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Europe
Device: pocketbook 360, kindle 4
Okay, just thinking aloud, so you're safe to click it:

Spoiler:
I'm thinking it must be a combination of probabilities and games theory. Which means that the fact that no one got away yet is a clue in itself.

What is the probability of each person being either blue or green? As it is random, I would have thought it's 50%. But in actual fact, it's 55% for blue, 45% for green. Is it because the numbers are relatively small, or is this the actual probability of each colour?

I tried to think by starting small. So you are inside the prison and the only other person is blue. What do you think about yourself? When one more comes along, how does the probability change? Not sure.

We have two groups of people with different views. Greens all see the same things as each other, so what one green does, every green does, as they are all so bright and clever. Same goes for blues. I'm not yet sure if the 100th person is in a different category or not. I feel he must be, but can't yet explain it.

Now there is a speech in both versions, that seems to reveal nothing new. But it must reveal something. Facts: there are greens and there are blues, you are 100, it's afternoon. Nothing new, right? Did the 100th person come before noon? So is the fact that no one left yet significant?

There is a question about when someone will get out. So I'm guessing there must be a test period, like wait one day, and when no one does something, you deduce something. All too general to help anyone, but well....

See? Not really a spoiler at all, just random thoughts that probably add nothing.
omk3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 03:29 PM   #18
poohbear_nc
Non-Edible Chicken
poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
poohbear_nc's Avatar
 
Posts: 28,244
Karma: 46126825
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Durham, NC
Device: Every Kindle Ever Made & To Be Made + Kobo Aura + Nexus7.2!
Quote:
Originally Posted by omk3 View Post
Okay, just thinking aloud, so you're safe to click it:

Spoiler:
I'm thinking it must be a combination of probabilities and games theory. Which means that the fact that no one got away yet is a clue in itself.

What is the probability of each person being either blue or green? As it is random, I would have thought it's 50%. But in actual fact, it's 55% for blue, 45% for green. Is it because the numbers are relatively small, or is this the actual probability of each colour?

I tried to think by starting small. So you are inside the prison and the only other person is blue. What do you think about yourself? When one more comes along, how does the probability change? Not sure.

We have two groups of people with different views. Greens all see the same things as each other, so what one green does, every green does, as they are all so bright and clever. Same goes for blues. I'm not yet sure if the 100th person is in a different category or not. I feel he must be, but can't yet explain it.

Now there is a speech in both versions, that seems to reveal nothing new. But it must reveal something. Facts: there are greens and there are blues, you are 100, it's afternoon. Nothing new, right? Did the 100th person come before noon? So is the fact that no one left yet significant?

There is a question about when someone will get out. So I'm guessing there must be a test period, like wait one day, and when no one does something, you deduce something. All too general to help anyone, but well....

See? Not really a spoiler at all, just random thoughts that probably add nothing.

This puzzle is making your antennae point in different directions!!!
poohbear_nc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 03:49 PM   #19
dreams
It's about the umbrella
dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
dreams's Avatar
 
Posts: 25,070
Karma: 56218156
Join Date: Jan 2009
Device: Sony 505| K Fire | KK 3G+Wi-Fi | iPhone 3Gs |Vista 32-bit Hm Prem w/FF
Oh wow, this one is a good one, pdurrant. Although, if it requires some kind of algebraic equation to set up and solve, I'm not sure I'll be able to figure out which one and actually do it.

I must give this some more thought.
dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 04:02 PM   #20
MJK2111
FUBAR!
MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MJK2111 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
MJK2111's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,910
Karma: 15000455
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Woodstock, IL
Device: Kindle 3, Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 S
I'm guessing that "get a razor blade, slice off a tiny bit of your forehead, and look at the color" is not a viable answer?
MJK2111 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 04:02 PM   #21
omk3
Wizard
omk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five words
 
omk3's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,454
Karma: 37243
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Europe
Device: pocketbook 360, kindle 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by poohbear_nc View Post
This puzzle is making your antennae point in different directions!!!
I know!

So, people, any other thoughts? Even silly like mine? Come on! We have to all work together for a successful prison break
omk3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 04:34 PM   #22
dsvick
Wizard
dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dsvick ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
dsvick's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,737
Karma: 635747
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast Ohio, USA
Device: PRS-900
Quote:
Originally Posted by omk3 View Post
I know!

So, people, any other thoughts? Even silly like mine? Come on! We have to all work together for a successful prison break
Spoiler:
I was thinking along the lines of if they knew the order in which they arrived then knowing that were two colors represented at the time of the governors speech, then they could back track and the first person that only saw a single other color would know that he has the opposite color.

Or something like that, I'm not sure it holds water though...
dsvick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:12 PM   #23
dreams
It's about the umbrella
dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
dreams's Avatar
 
Posts: 25,070
Karma: 56218156
Join Date: Jan 2009
Device: Sony 505| K Fire | KK 3G+Wi-Fi | iPhone 3Gs |Vista 32-bit Hm Prem w/FF
OK, dsvick, before I click your spoiler (and by the way I can't quote it as it will show what is under it), it is a thinking about the problem clue or a partial solution?
dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:15 PM   #24
omk3
Wizard
omk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five words
 
omk3's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,454
Karma: 37243
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Europe
Device: pocketbook 360, kindle 4
The spoiler in post #13 is harmless, dreams. It's just to help you thinking. Hasn't helped me yet...

Oh, sorry. Dsvick's harmless too. Just a thought. Maybe an interesting one, but I'm not sure yet. I'm too easily confused today.
omk3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:20 PM   #25
dreams
It's about the umbrella
dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.dreams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
dreams's Avatar
 
Posts: 25,070
Karma: 56218156
Join Date: Jan 2009
Device: Sony 505| K Fire | KK 3G+Wi-Fi | iPhone 3Gs |Vista 32-bit Hm Prem w/FF
Thanks, omk3. I like to try these even though some are way over my head. I'll be off to work soon and will have to check back and keep trying when I get home tonight.

Good luck, these puzzles are fun to try and watch everyone's comments too.
dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:27 PM   #26
pdurrant
The Grand Mouse
pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
pdurrant's Avatar
 
Posts: 30,772
Karma: 85457880
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Norfolk, England
Device: NOOK ST GlowLight
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsvick View Post
Do the prisoners know in what order the other prisoners, and colors, were added?
Well, the first prisoner in knows of course. And the second prisoner. The third prisoner to enter the jail just knows that the first two were there before him, although they might have told him which of them was there first. Etc.

So at least two of the prisoners know the order. I don't think this knowledge helps them or you.
pdurrant is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:30 PM   #27
pdurrant
The Grand Mouse
pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
pdurrant's Avatar
 
Posts: 30,772
Karma: 85457880
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Norfolk, England
Device: NOOK ST GlowLight
Quote:
Originally Posted by omk3 View Post
Okay, just thinking aloud, so you're safe to click it:
I'll address some of your thoughts, just the clarify things that might not have been perfectly clear in the problem statement.

(i) the 45/55 split is just random chance. The problem still works with any similar numbers, e.g. 35/65, 50/50, 51/49, etc. The exact answer might be a little different though.

(ii) probability arguments won't help. The prisoner can't be 99% or 99.9% or even 99.99999% certain. The prisoner must be able to prove that they know their ink colour by a process of logical deduction.

Last edited by pdurrant; 06-16-2010 at 05:34 PM.
pdurrant is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:31 PM   #28
pdurrant
The Grand Mouse
pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.pdurrant ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
pdurrant's Avatar
 
Posts: 30,772
Karma: 85457880
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Norfolk, England
Device: NOOK ST GlowLight
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJK2111 View Post
I'm guessing that "get a razor blade, slice off a tiny bit of your forehead, and look at the color" is not a viable answer?
Yes, that's not the kind of solution we (or the prisoners) are looking for.
pdurrant is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 05:31 PM   #29
omk3
Wizard
omk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five wordsomk3 can name that ebook in five words
 
omk3's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,454
Karma: 37243
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Europe
Device: pocketbook 360, kindle 4
Thanks! Probabilities out of the way is actually a relief...
omk3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2010, 06:17 PM   #30
poohbear_nc
Non-Edible Chicken
poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.poohbear_nc ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
poohbear_nc's Avatar
 
Posts: 28,244
Karma: 46126825
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Durham, NC
Device: Every Kindle Ever Made & To Be Made + Kobo Aura + Nexus7.2!
Start digging the tunnel! No solution in sight!
poohbear_nc is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Unutterably Silly The Real Great Escape? recluse Lounge 2 09-17-2010 01:04 AM
Unutterably Silly Escape Committee LazyScot Lounge 555 06-08-2010 09:56 AM
eScape Bug Fix Release Munish ePub 0 03-23-2009 08:46 AM
eScape ePub Transfer Issue Timoleon ePub 4 03-15-2009 09:57 AM
Unutterably Silly Escape Pole RWood Lounge 30 02-26-2009 11:44 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:51 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.