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Old 08-21-2007, 04:33 PM   #61
rlauzon
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I'm sorry, but Open Office is a closed program. It will not run on a VAX running VMS. So it's no good. It's too closed. Do you have something that will run on a VAX with VMS to make ebooks. If not, I'm afraid, what you have is closed. I hope you know that you've chosen to use a closed program. It cannot run on a VAX with XMS, then well, it's just a closed format.
I debated responding to this since it simply drips of ignorance.

You might want to check out the Wikipedia page.
(Open Office does run on VMS.)

And, unlike the MobiPocket format, the OpenDocument format is an international standard and published for anyone to see.
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Old 08-21-2007, 05:05 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by rlauzon View Post
I debated responding to this since it simply drips of ignorance.

You might want to check out the Wikipedia page.
(Open Office does run on VMS.)

And, unlike the MobiPocket format, the OpenDocument format is an international standard and published for anyone to see.
Sorry, OpenVMS is not the same as VMS.

Well vvv has figured out how to write MobiPocket format book with Book Designer, so it can be figured out.
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Old 08-21-2007, 06:29 PM   #63
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Mobipocket is the palmdoc format with a few extra tags (documented on their website) and sometimes proprietary compression and/or encryption added. It's not the evil you make it out to be.
Palmdoc format is a plain ASCII text file, compressed with RLE compression for an approximate 40% space savings. It was originated by Aportis for their Aportis Reader program, back in the days when Palm OS devices had 2 - 8MB of RAM and no expansion storage capability, so saving RAM was highly desireable. Aportis went out of business years ago, but the doc format was reverse engineered and is widely supported. MobiReader for Palm will read Palm doc files as well as it's own format. So will eReader, which uses Palm Markup Language, originated by Peanut Press.

Mobi takes text formatted with their markup language and puts in in a Palm Database. That's not the same thing as Palmdoc.
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Last edited by DMcCunney; 08-21-2007 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 08-21-2007, 06:47 PM   #64
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I'm sorry, but Open Office is a closed program. It will not run on a VAX running VMS. So it's no good. It's too closed. Do you have something that will run on a VAX with VMS to make ebooks. If not, I'm afraid, what you have is closed. I hope you know that you've chosen to use a closed program. It cannot run on a VAX with XMS, then well, it's just a closed format.
Open Office has a port to OpenVMS. According to HP (who now have the former DEC VMS/OpenVMS operations), user-mode code for VMS should run on OpenVMS. Privileged-mode mode code may require changes and relinking. (I haven't logged time on a VAX since before OpenVMS existed, and have no idea offhand if Open Office on OpenVMS does anything that requires privileged-mode.)

If it in fact doesn't run on VMS but does run on OpenVMS, hey, the source is available. It should be possible to get it to run on VMS. All that is required is someone with the development environment and a need great enough to justify the effort.

And since the format for Open Office documents is documented, it should be possible to create VMS applications that can read/write them, even if Open Office itself isn't available.

If you want to pick fine enough nits, you can claim any format isn't open, since there will be some platform that won't be able to read it.
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Old 08-21-2007, 08:02 PM   #65
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If you want to pick fine enough nits, you can claim any format isn't open, since there will be some platform that won't be able to read it.
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I'm just picking the same sorts of nits that rlauzon is picking with his arguments. It's just too easy to find a platform that doesn't have something other platform(s) do.
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Old 08-22-2007, 05:10 AM   #66
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I'm just picking the same sorts of nits that rlauzon is picking with his arguments. It's just too easy to find a platform that doesn't have something other platform(s) do.
And (as usual it seems) you completely missed my point in doing so.

Any eBook format must be:
1. Open - meaning that it should be able to be converted to any other format.
2. Standard - meaning that the full specifications are documented.

If an eBook is not open and standard, then it is worth less than the paper version. It is, in effect, a leased book because, at some point, it will not be readable.

Since we seem to be focusing on the MobiPocket format lately, I've been picking on that format.

The MobiPocket reader supports 2 formats: HTML in a PalmDOC format and the MobiPocket format based on Open eBook standard (but using a closed, proprietary file system to store the files).

Currently, the only way to make a MobiPocket eBook is by using the closed, proprietary software that MobiPocket provides. To the best of my knowledge, there is no way to reverse a MobiPocket eBook (i.e. turn it back into the Open eBook files).

This makes MobiPocket a poor choice for eBooks.
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Old 08-22-2007, 04:32 PM   #67
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Currently, the only way to make a MobiPocket eBook is by using the closed, proprietary software that MobiPocket provides. To the best of my knowledge, there is no way to reverse a MobiPocket eBook (i.e. turn it back into the Open eBook files).
Actually for non-drm'ed Mobipocket, BD should convert it; I used to be able to do it before Fbreader read unencrypted Mobipocket, but since then I never bothered; actually I sometimes do the reverse, take a lit book, convert it to .opf and then make it Mobipocket for my 770 since even though Fbreader reads .opf, sometimes it misses stuff like footnotes that it does not in Mobipocket.
I kind of like both Mobipocket and MsLit as long as they are not encrypted, but I still loathe pdf as an ebook format.
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Old 08-28-2007, 06:38 PM   #68
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I can't stand DRM, and have said so many times in my short time on this forum. I believe it's a parasite that the nascent eBook industry can't afford as it fails in its stated goal of copy protection and puts obstacles in the way of the honest customer. At the very least I find the presence of DRM to be a value reducer. I also dislike PDF as a reading format. It's a printing format, pure and simple.

I don't mind mobipocket, their .prc container works well with uBook which is my preferred reader, and it's easy to convert things to it. It may be proprietary but it fulfills my needs.

As to eBooks, I buy Baen or multi-format from Fictionwise. The only way to get the products we want is to vote with open wallets. If I only buy unencrypted eBooks, and turn down the secure formats even when they are free that provides people like Fictionwise with ammunition. They can go to publishers and say that people spend more money on unencrypted eBooks, and if they provide theirs in multi-format sales will go up.
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Old 09-04-2007, 08:55 PM   #69
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If you have say two eink devices, a Sony and an iLiad, you buy books in BBeB & MobiPocket and can read on either device. One device say fails to work and goes off for warrenty repair, there goes reading on that device the books you bough as your DRM prevents converting over for the other device. DRM, screw you!
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Old 09-04-2007, 09:29 PM   #70
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T

Nonsense. The leading DRM format for eBooks is MobiPocket, and that certainly hasn't been broken.


Past tense now!!
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Old 09-04-2007, 09:33 PM   #71
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Nonsense. The leading DRM format for eBooks is MobiPocket, and that certainly hasn't been broken.
MobiPocket's DRM has been broken, LIT has been broken, Adobe's DRM has been broken.. The only DRM that's as of yet unbroken is BBeB and eReader. It's just a matter of time until they are busted.
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Old 09-04-2007, 10:01 PM   #72
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Or perhaps Sony'll shift from BBeB to .EPUB. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants?
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Old 09-04-2007, 11:24 PM   #73
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Or perhaps Sony'll shift from BBeB to .EPUB. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants?
But will Digital Editions support DRM?
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Old 09-04-2007, 11:27 PM   #74
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I thought it already did.

Adobe supports DRM in PDF, I don't know why they wouldn't for DE. But that's not a definite answer.
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Old 09-05-2007, 12:43 PM   #75
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And don't forget if that's all you order from Amazon, you'll get charged $3.99 for shipping. So the price really is $19.99.
I don't remember the last time I paid for ANY shipping from Amazon.com. I always bump up my orders to $25 and get the free shipping.

Occasionally I'll buy from Amazon.co.uk so I'll pay for the air-mail shipping, but domestically, not for 2 or 3 years! (occasional Marketplace orders aside).
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