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Old 04-04-2010, 05:13 PM   #1
askyn
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Question about sorting on the 360

Hi all /wave

First off, just as back ground info etc.

I use Calibre to format / keep track of my books, I have all the meta data entered etc. ( author, series, title blah blah =) )

I can sort things properly inside calibre, so I know that the info is there ok.

Now, on the 360 it self what im tring to do is sort the directories by Author then series.

Every author has thier own directory with all thier books inside it.

The directoreis sort just fine, but when I go into a directory to see the book, they dont sor but in alpha order.

If I select sort by series, they still are jumbled up. Not sorted by series order etc.

Any help or suggestions? Im not even sure its possible to do what im looking for.

IE - Authors directories sorted by alpha, inside each folder / directory sort the books by series order.

Thank you.
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Old 04-04-2010, 06:57 PM   #2
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Currently its only possible to choose one setting for the sorting, as you did.

Are you using the newest firmware?
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Old 04-05-2010, 01:03 AM   #3
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Is there any chance of an update where the Pocketbook will recognize tags? The only thing I really miss from my Sony readers is how well they sort my books. I can sort them by author, title, by date added, by date last opened and by collection. And one book can be in as many collections as I want -- I can tag it with three different tags to have it be in three different collections. Sony's sorting software really outclasses any of the others I've seen.

Having all my books in folders by author has been a let-down after the wonderful sorting by Sony. I almost considered getting a PRS-300 since I've discovered I love a small screen so much, but the lack of a memory card slot is a deal-killer for me.

-Marcy
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Old 04-05-2010, 08:10 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcy View Post
Is there any chance of an update where the Pocketbook will recognize tags?
The reason the Sony lets you sort by arbitrary tags is that they use a separate database application and its associated datastore to manage the ebook files rather than the actual device/flash card file system. This database stores a master index table listing all your ebooks and where they are stored along with the associated tags.
The pro: is improved sorting, saves space in storage with no need for multiple copies of a book
The cons: are lack of folder support (they use a flat-file database rather than a relational one), slower performance when adding lots of ebooks (its my understanding that adding ebooks to Sony ereaders should be done a handful at a time, not hundreds at once), slower boot times, and slower launch times. It takes time to create the global index, it takes time to load a large index file, it takes time to find data in it. On a PB360 this would mean dealing with an index of up to 32GB worth of ebooks. On a device with 64MB of working RAM and a 400MHz CPU.

Now, if somebody *really* cared, they could easily code an alternate bookshelf app to provide all sorts of fancy sorts and space-saving cross-links. Nothing about the PB architecture stops it. Odds are, however, it will likely work without folders and take forever to import large collections of ebooks. Calibre on PC has a *lot* of computing resources at its command and it takes its time importing a lot of books--now imagine trying to do the same with the more modest power off the PB ARM cpu. Especially when you add in the need to address up to 32GB of ebook data in the index.

Its all about trade-offs; features don't come for free, they cost memory and CPU cycles to use and they cost time and effort to create. If enough people ask about it, it might happen. If...

In the meantime, have you considered that the built-in search feature might make tags unnecesary? Tags are for indexing lists which are generally used in the absence of a search function.

Maybe attacking the problem from a different direction, a combination of folder organization and a global naming strategy will let you use the search function to find books directly, instead of sorting and eyeballing. The PB architecture gives you a lot of file management features; they're just not the *same* features as Sony gives you. And, of course, different tools require a different approach. ("If all you have is a hammer, eventually all problems look like nails".) (True, some times you do need a hammer, but often a screwdriver will work, too. )

Remember, you have the option of displaying the ebook's metadata instead of its file name and its file name can be anything you want so you can add tags in the filename at will.

Me, I organize my ebooks via folder structure:
Genre-->Author--->Series---->Title

And by file name:
Author-Series-Vol-Title

I also use calibre to make sure the metadata is complete and accurate.

Your needs likely will be different but the existing features might help if you give it a try. Or maybe not.
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:56 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcy View Post
Sony's sorting software really outclasses any of the others I've seen.
Let me strongly disagree with you.

Yes, Sony firmware does feature tags. But that is about it.
If you want Sony firmware to work at all using tags you have to use their software to load the books.

Go ahead. Try loading 1000 books to your Sony Reader using calibre. The Reader will choke on that many books.
I will take multi level directories over tags any day.
Try inserting an SD card with 1GB of books on it. The reader will choke for hours.
With PocketBook the boot time is 10 seconds regardless of number of books you have on device/cards.
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Old 04-05-2010, 07:53 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kacir View Post
Let me strongly disagree with you.

Yes, Sony firmware does feature tags. But that is about it.
If you want Sony firmware to work at all using tags you have to use their software to load the books.

Go ahead. Try loading 1000 books to your Sony Reader using calibre. The Reader will choke on that many books.
I will take multi level directories over tags any day.
Try inserting an SD card with 1GB of books on it. The reader will choke for hours.
With PocketBook the boot time is 10 seconds regardless of number of books you have on device/cards.
I loaded 1354 books onto my PRS-900 using Calibre when I first got it. About 1GB. It took a few minutes to start up after that, but certainly didn't choke for hours. I did something similar with my PRS-600 when I first got it, but it was about 1100 books.

The PRS-900 always took a few minutes to start-up after being connected to the computer, but I am totally willing to put up with that to get everything organized how I like it.

-Marcy
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Old 04-05-2010, 07:57 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
The reason the Sony lets you sort by arbitrary tags is that they use a separate database application and its associated datastore to manage the ebook files rather than the actual device/flash card file system. This database stores a master index table listing all your ebooks and where they are stored along with the associated tags.
The pro: is improved sorting, saves space in storage with no need for multiple copies of a book
The cons: are lack of folder support (they use a flat-file database rather than a relational one), slower performance when adding lots of ebooks (its my understanding that adding ebooks to Sony ereaders should be done a handful at a time, not hundreds at once), slower boot times, and slower launch times. It takes time to create the global index, it takes time to load a large index file, it takes time to find data in it. On a PB360 this would mean dealing with an index of up to 32GB worth of ebooks. On a device with 64MB of working RAM and a 400MHz CPU.

In the meantime, have you considered that the built-in search feature might make tags unnecesary? Tags are for indexing lists which are generally used in the absence of a search function.
There is really no need for folders on the Sony. Collections give you everything you could need in folders and more. Anything you want in a "folder" just needs to be tagged with the folder name.

Search isn't really helpful. If I know what I want to read, I can find it without a problem. My issue is I have over 500 books to read. When trying to decide what to read I would browse the author-title list or the collections and see if something caught my fancy. With the PB360 I only see author folders, and have to enter each folder to see what titles I have and haven't read yet. Worse is everytime I back out of an author folder I am dumped back at the last folder, instead of where I was in the browsing. When you have 37 pages of author folders that is a big hassle.

-Marcy
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