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Old 03-22-2013, 02:02 PM   #31
speakingtohe
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
Baen is the poster child for anti-DRM success.




It'll be a while, but they'll drop DRM--because they hate Amazon. As long as their books are DRM'd, their Amazon customers aren't going to leave for other stores. (I find this hilarious. The publishers don't like Amazon's success, but they don't want to remove their content from the store. It's like they think Amazon should run itself for *their* benefit, rather than for Amazon's profit.)
Sorry I left out Baen. Can't seem to figure if they are successful or not.

And people hating Amazon enough to forgo profit may possibly be a minority group.

I imagine most of us would like it if everyone ran things for our benefit. Today Amazon and all the book sellers, tomorrow the world.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:07 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
It'll be a while, but they'll drop DRM--because they hate Amazon.
This. It'll be just like when the music publishers dropped DRM because they hated Apple. (They gave Amazon permission to sell DRM-free tracks several months before Apple were allowed to do the same.)

What I can't understand is how the book publishers are willing to spend $0.22+ per ebook on Adobe's DRM.

Dropping DRM and increasing profit per ebook by $0.22 should be a no-brainer.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:13 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by pdurrant View Post
This. It'll be just like when the music publishers dropped DRM because they hated Apple. (They gave Amazon permission to sell DRM-free tracks several months before Apple were allowed to do the same.)

What I can't understand is how the book publishers are willing to spend $0.22+ per ebook on Adobe's DRM.

Dropping DRM and increasing profit per ebook by $0.22 should be a no-brainer.
Perhaps they think right or wrong that selling x books at 9.99 is marginally better than selling less books at 9.77. Go figure.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:31 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speakingtohe View Post
Perhaps they think right or wrong that selling x books at 9.99 is marginally better than selling less books at 9.77. Go figure.
Got any evidence that removing the DRM will reduce sales?

And I wasn't suggesting selling a $9.99 ebook at $9.77. I was suggesting making $7.21 from a $9.99 ebook instead of $6.99.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:39 PM   #35
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To clarify for "AnemicOak" (an ill oak in Minnesota?) My post expressed my impression of
the situation based on what appears to be the results in the marketplace. I have no
leaked e-mails, interdepartmental memos, or whistle blower testimony, and the interworkings of such corporations are seldom made public. I too would love to have
more factual information on this subject, from any who have been involved in the process.

That a company would go to the trouble to develop/adapt a DRM system that restricted
the use of the ebooks they sell to only those devices and applications that they sell/control, is a considerable expense and commitment on their part. Such actions are
not often taken without some potential profit in mind.

I have no proof that "they" have made it a part of their negotiations with authors and
publishers, and it could be that no overt actions are part of the process. It would be
odd though if they went to the trouble to create their own proprietary DRM and
neglected to promote it. That they allow no other DRM on the books they sell might
indicate something, as well.

Luck;
Ken
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Old 03-22-2013, 05:54 PM   #36
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Book retailers provide DRM because the major publishers require it.
No DRM, no sales of those publishers' eBooks.
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:10 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murraypaul View Post
Book retailers provide DRM because the major publishers require it.
No DRM, no sales of those publishers' eBooks.
This seems false to me since if the publisher told the book retailer that they could choose to have DRM or not at least Amazon would choose to have DRM.
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:15 PM   #38
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This seems false to me since if the publisher told the book retailer that they could choose to have DRM or not at least Amazon would choose to have DRM.
Even assuming that Amazon would make that choice, how does it make what I said false?
The major publishers do require DRM. Retailers must provide it to sell those eBooks.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:08 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdurrant View Post
.What I can't understand is how the book publishers are willing to spend $0.22+ per ebook on Adobe's DRM.

Dropping DRM and increasing profit per ebook by $0.22 should be a no-brainer.
Obviously they believe it will increase their profits by more than $0.22. If not using DRM costs them sales, it's a simple formula to figure out the break even point.

That their belief is wrong is irrelevant. It would be foolish of them to act against their beliefs, and even more foolish of us to expect them to.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:09 PM   #40
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Got any evidence that removing the DRM will reduce sales?
Got any evidence that it won't?
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:11 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tompe View Post
This seems false to me since if the publisher told the book retailer that they could choose to have DRM or not at least Amazon would choose to have DRM.
Amazon don't make that choice with indie books published via KDP. The author/publisher gets to choose whether to use DRM or not. Neither option is selected by default, so the author/publisher has to choose.

Of course, they may make a different choice with a big publisher, but the only evidence I'm aware of (ie how they act with KDP-published books) suggests that Amazon don't really care whether DRM is used or not.

Last edited by avantman42; 03-22-2013 at 07:16 PM. Reason: Changed "They" to "Amazon" to improve clarity
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:14 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by taustin View Post
Got any evidence that it won't?
Yes. Following quote is taken from this post

Quote:
This year we went DRM-free at TOR. It is still too early to tell the outcome, but initial results suggest there was no increase in piracy.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:21 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avantman42 View Post
but the only evidence I'm aware of (ie how they act with KDP-published books) suggests that Amazon don't really care whether DRM is used or not.
IIRC aren't all Amazon published books (ie put out by Amazon Publishing) DRM'd? That would seem to show they care when it comes to what they themselves are putting out.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:30 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by AnemicOak View Post
IIRC aren't all Amazon published books (ie put out by Amazon Publishing) DRM'd? That would seem to show they care when it comes to what they themselves are putting out.
I'd forgotten they have their own publishing arm I honestly don't know if they're DRM'd or not. You're right, though, that would probably be a better indicator of whether or not Amazon would choose to use DRM if the publisher left the choice to them.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:41 PM   #45
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Got any evidence that it won't?
Yes. Tor.
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