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Old 03-18-2013, 10:49 PM   #361
Prestidigitweeze
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Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
He just wanted to *really* draw people in, to get them so involved with the characters you *needed* to know what comes next. Kinda like the way LOST drew it its audience.
Thank you for belaboring the irrelevant. There's far too much joy in life.

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Old 03-18-2013, 11:38 PM   #362
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What we have been talking about a lot here is genre snobs.

But what about intellectual snobs?

In UK there is a sort of intellectual snobbery related to class (always a key issue in UK), whereby the height of an imaginary reader's forehead is invoked.

High brow, middle brow, airport novels.

This is a form of class coding, I think. Highbrow books are read by public school old boys (and girls), university professors, and judges of literary prizes.

Middle brow books are read by lower-and middle-middle class people who "think they are reading Literature."

The rest read airport novels. Presumably they don't have brows.
I smiled. We still overwhelmingly think in these categories, but Dwight MacDonald would argue (as early as the 1960s) that they have been surpassed by what he called MidCult, or what I affectionately refer to as upper-middle-brow literature.

"In these more advanced times, the danger to High Culture is not so much from Masscult as from a peculiar hybrid bred from the latter’s unnatural intercourse with the former. A whole middle culture has come into existence and it threatens to absorb both its parents. This intermediate form—let us call it Midcult—has the essential qualities of Masscult—the formula, the built-in reaction, the lack of any standard except popularity—but it decently covers them with a cultural figleaf. In Masscult the trick is plain—to please the crowd by any means. But Midcult has it both ways: it pretends to respect the standards of High Culture while in fact it waters them down and vulgarizes them."
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Old 03-19-2013, 01:16 PM   #363
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When I was a child and when I was young (I'm almost 60) I used to get teased and looked down on a lot. I think my behaviour was a little "off" because I had so many problems back then. But it means that I have come to a point where I really honestly don't care what other people think about the things I do.

I believe that if you let other people decide what you would read - or at least what you would read in public - you are giving them way too much power over you.

I'm wierd and do a lot of wierd stuff and so what? For instans I like to read books for teens. I just read The Tommorrow series by John Marsden and I loved it.

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Old 03-19-2013, 01:20 PM   #364
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Old 03-22-2013, 12:36 AM   #365
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I was at the doctors the other day when my doc asked what I was reading in my Kindle. I told her it was "Last Ape Standing" and that it was about Neanderthals. She immediately said, "I would never read something like that". I just smiled and said, "that's why I'm special".

I love Neanderthals dammit. When I was growing up scientists were always looking for "the missing link". Come to find out, we were separate species. And now they are finding we probably interbred. I love it.
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:16 AM   #366
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The surprise for me in this thread was not seeing graphic novels or audio books being held up to be judged.

I admit I think a comic is a comic and will never be a novel in my eyes, and as far as audio books go that is just not a book, it is like watching the movie and saying you read the book.

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Old 03-22-2013, 07:44 AM   #367
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Originally Posted by applesauce View Post
I admit I think a comic is a comic and will never be a novel in my eyes, and as far as audio books go that is just not a book, it is like watching the movie and saying you read the book.

applesauce
I have to disagree. Whilst I accept listening to the book is a different experience from reading it, you still cover off every word that is in the book - not at all the same as watching the movie.
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:53 AM   #368
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A comic (as some mangas prove) can reach the story depth and length of a novel. Audiobook is just a (IMO inferior) different method of transmission for written text.
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Old 03-22-2013, 08:29 AM   #369
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Originally Posted by applesauce View Post
and as far as audio books go that is just not a book, it is like watching the movie and saying you read the book.

applesauce
I too have to dissagree. Like orlok said you get every word that's in the book. It's not at all like a movie. I actually more think of it as when I was little and my mom would read to me.

When my son was a kid - even years after he was able to read himself - I would read to him a lot. We could spend an intire Saturday afternoon just me reading to him because we both enjoyed it so much. It was not at all like watching a movie together.


Apart from that there's a lot of good reasons to use audio books. Like if you're blind or sick. When I have to lay in bed because of illness listening to audio books can be a great comford. Sometimes I'm just too tired or too much in pain to read myself.


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Old 03-22-2013, 09:03 AM   #370
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maybe the idea of comparing an audio book to a movie was wrong. I just do not see it as reading a book tho, My view may come from my own experience at trying them. I found it was not happening in my head, the voice gave it an interpretation as a movie does, not my own as a book allows. I also hated the accent and how slow they read. But then I hated being read to as a child.

My comment tho was my suprise that in this thread I never saw a snob attitute to either.

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Old 03-22-2013, 10:14 AM   #371
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Some people *love* being read to.
Others love the convenience of audiobooks, especially the digital ones they can listen to while jogging, exercising, puttering about the house, even driving.
For the time-constrained or the dyslexic they are a godsend.
Ditto for good quality, modern, TTS. Which, BTW, has gotten very, very good.
It'll never get quite as good as a good human reader (without an "Inflexion Markup Language standard) but for many it will suffice.
I've only done audiobooks once or twice but I don't see anything wrong or degraded about them.
And graphic novels, even western ones, come in many flavors.
Some are in the vein of highly illustrated text novels while others are more like print movies. Either way, the narrative depth and prose quality can be every bit as good as the best narrative text story or as bad as the worst cliche.

Sturgeon's law applies everywhere.
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:18 PM   #372
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I'm an audiobook fan. I will frequently listen to a book after I've read it (not immediately, of course, but later) - a good narrator can make a mediocre book good, just as a bad narrator can ruin an excellent book.

Audiobooks play a different role than paper/ebooks do, but they're an equally valid way of ingesting a book.
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Old 03-22-2013, 06:45 PM   #373
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I'm an audiobook fan. I will frequently listen to a book after I've read it (not immediately, of course, but later) - a good narrator can make a mediocre book good, just as a bad narrator can ruin an excellent book.

Audiobooks play a different role than paper/ebooks do, but they're an equally valid way of ingesting a book.
Amen to all points. As an example, I didn't think Under the Dome was a particularly good Stephen King novel, but the narrator of the audiobook version was fantastic. He made those characters. I always listen to the samples prior to buying an audiobook, some of the narrators are indeed awful.

For many years I didn't care for audiobooks, either. However, I've found in the past few years that audiobooks are excellent for non-fiction books, which I've always had a hard time reading, but listening to them is sort of like listening to talk radio, and is great for driving. I've started listening to a lot of fiction as well, and I am getting through a lot more books by turning them on when doing housework, getting dressed in the morning, suffering from middle of the night insomnia, etc.
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Old 03-23-2013, 02:38 AM   #374
QuantumIguana
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I listen to books during my commute to and from work, when I'm on long drives or when I just need something to keep my mind occupied while I do some other task. I've grown to like test to speech, but it took some getting used to. I also really enjoy librivox recordings, I've been listening to the Barsoom books.
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Old 03-23-2013, 10:48 AM   #375
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Just started Audio books in December...must say they grow on you....TTS ..just starting but a good voice helps ....
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