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Old 01-14-2013, 07:49 AM   #61
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When I upgraded to an iPad 3 I was underwhelmed by the difference... the screen looked to me a bit better than that on my first-gen iPad.
I recently got a mini and, while I love it, the screen does look grainy to me now.
I guess it's easy to get used to a better screen.... but when you downgrade, you DO notice.
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Old 01-14-2013, 09:38 AM   #62
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Red face

You probably aren't an iPhone 4+ user. Those of us who have owned iPhone 4 since day 1, have been painfully aware of the inferiority of the iPad 1 / iPad 2 screens for a few years now.

I have bad eyesight and need pretty strong glasses (5+ diopters). However, the screen on iPhone 4+ is so sharp it compensates for my bad eyesight. I'm able to read the iPhone 4+ screen without any glasses on, and without feeling any eye-strain. But this was never possible for me with the iPad 1 or iPad 2 screen. Without glasses, the iPad 1 / iPad 2 screen looks even grainier than while wearing them.

Last spring, at long last, iPad 3 caught up with iPhone 4 in terms of display quality. It took almost 2 years for the iPad to get there. And, sure enough, now I'm able to read on iPad 3 without using my glasses. Even so, I can still see that the iPad 3 screen isn't quite as sharp as iPhone 4 -- but it's excellent enough. But the contrast to iPad 1 / iPad 2 screen is brutal and radical. I'm sure I wouldn't be able to read the current iPad mini's screen without glasses on -- 163 ppi is just very poor for 2013 standards.

Now, my theory as to why Apple overpriced the iPad mini so much. It makes no sense for the device to cost so much ($330) while sporting an inferior screen. My theory is, that an iPad mini with the Retina display is coming, but that the price will remain the same. And then, perhaps, it might be justified.

Why? Because the only option left for Apple regarding the iPad mini screen, is to exactly double its resolution. Any other solution would bring lots of headaches for everyone, especially software developers.

So, Apple will do the same thing with iPad mini, that they did with the iPhone and the regular iPad before: they will double the current screen resolution. However, if they do that, then the Retina iPad mini will become, hands down, the finest screen that Apple will have ever produced on any platform. The Retina iPad mini's screen will very likely not only have a much higher ppi than the regular 10-inch iPad 3, iPad 4 (currently at 264 ppi), but it will likely also pass and overtake the iPhone's ppi, which is a fantastic 326 ppi today.

Those of you who are good at maths can calculate this right now. 2048 pixels * 1536 pixels across only 7.9 inches of screen space -- how many ppi is this? Definitely a lot more than on the current iPad 3, iPad 4 (with the Retina MacBook Pro lagging far behind at only about 227 ppi). Hence, the iPad mini's inflated price.

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Old 01-14-2013, 10:37 AM   #63
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BUT what I said is my eyes don't notice the difference so no advantage for me.
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Old 01-14-2013, 11:09 AM   #64
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Just curious, what iPhone and iPod do you have? Your list says iPad mini, iPad 2 -- and you wouldn't necessarily notice any difference between those two, the screen being similarly bad on both. Unless you've been a regular user of an iPhone 4+ or the equivalent iPod touch, the advantages of Retina screens might not be as readily discernible for you as for those users whose eyes have grown used to that quality and sharpness associated with Retina displays.

And, of course, everyone's mileage may differ. I'm typing this post on a MacBook Air, with iPad 3 open right next to it on the desk... and the difference in the quality of display, in favour of iPad 3, seems striking even to the naked eye at a casual glance.

PS: Just noticed on page 1 of this thread you used to have an iPad 3. Well, that's interesting.

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Old 01-14-2013, 12:39 PM   #65
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A friend of mine who buys just about every e-reading device out there was talking about how much she enjoyed reading on her iPad mini. I asked her about the resolution, knowing she was familiar with the retina screen from the full size iPad and she said the mini screen is fantastic. Still, I'm going to wait until March because I'd be mad if I bought one now and a better screen comes out in a couple of months.
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:44 PM   #66
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With my iPad 1 now "left behind" in regards to iOS updates I finally opened my wallet and ordered a refurbished iPad 3 from Apple....
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Old 01-20-2013, 04:47 PM   #67
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Several people have described the iPad Mini's display as "mediocre" or "lousy", but for millions of buyers they are not!

The display is crisp, clear, and readable--and even has more pixels per inch than the non-Retina iPads... and people extolled the great display on the original iPad when it came out.

Furthermore, there were many *blind* test comparisons of iPad 2 and iPad 3s in which the typical person could NOT pick which one had the retina display! I had that very experience at a Best Buy and it was a hoot watching both customers and BB salespeople unable to tell the difference!

Sure, if you blew up the text to a ridiculously large size (a handful or characters or lines on a page), you could see the difference, but for the most typical viewing, many, if not most, people could not distinguish the two--or were not bothered by any differences that existed!

So, while for many people, a non-retina display is a deal breaker, and feel that the screen looks "inferior", it is not an issue for millions of other users-- either in the past or present--either with the first two iPads or the mini!

This just goes to show you how idiosyncratic perception and judgments are.

An empirical issue: One key reason for the difference in perception could be how close people hold the screens to their eyes. I'll bet there's more difference in non-retina and retina displays seen by those who hold the screen closer to their eyes.

-----------------------------------------

On another matter...

Good Reader is a class act with an incredibly rich set of features. Its ability to resize and reflow text is something that I wish Apple would build into Safari.

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Old 01-20-2013, 04:57 PM   #68
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Red face

Nor would horse buggy riders describe their mode of transport as "lousy" or "inferior", because that's what they were used to, and the only thing they knew, before the advent of automobiles.

Sorry, but a screen with only 163 ppi is decidedly inferior when compared to the best-in-class displays in 2013.

That said, if you're happy with such a screen, more power to you. I just find the iPad mini way overpriced at $330, and the only way they can justify that price, to my mind, is by upgrading the iPad mini with a Retina screen, while keeping the price the same.

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Old 01-20-2013, 05:39 PM   #69
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A test for screen difference is something like yahoo or nytimes desktop versions in portrait mode. Even a zombie should easily be able to notice a difference between mini and retina ipads using that scenario.

I showed my eye doctor the mini's screen. She has 20/20 vision. She was not amused for $329. Put that in an Andriod tablet for that price now and who would buy it.

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Old 01-21-2013, 04:45 AM   #70
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and now we have trapped into millions of people argument...millions of ipad mini buyers cant be wrong...american pie is the best movie in the history of cinema because millions of viewers think so...apple made ipad mini from leftovers, that's a fact, and sell it for high price...if they (millions of mini buyers) didnt know better that apple will make it obsolete in just couple of months after purchase...
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Old 01-21-2013, 10:10 AM   #71
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and now we have trapped into millions of people argument...millions of ipad mini buyers cant be wrong...american pie is the best movie in the history of cinema because millions of viewers think so...apple made ipad mini from leftovers, that's a fact, and sell it for high price...if they (millions of mini buyers) didnt know better that apple will make it obsolete in just couple of months after purchase...
The allure of the mini is the size and weight. The display is not terrible except for what I brought up but alternatives are available, landscape mode or use a browser whereby font size can be increased.

If you wants that os for cheaper than the larger ipads, then so be it. 4:3 aspect ratio has its merits too I suppose over andriod tablets.
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Old 01-21-2013, 10:57 AM   #72
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[T]hings just work right on my iPad and iPt5 whereas not much ever worked right on any Android tablet I ever owned. Android apps are typically poorly written and barely tested crap. I found that if I want to accomplish anything constructive on a tablet or phone it needs to run iOS.
Two years ago, I'd have understood your point, which leads me to wonder whether you've used a phone or tablet with Jellybean yet. The Nexus 4 is a solid answer to UI complaints which Google have noted and tried to fix systematically. So are Nexuses 7 and 10. Similarly, a number of Android apps have been improved.

Because every OS is fluid, it might be a mistake to make claims for iOS over Android at every single stage of development. Seamless hardware-software integration is a constant with Apple, but Google now does almost the same thing strategically while maintaining Microsoft's everyman compatibility with devices which aren't in-house.

The irony of the Mini is that, for the first time, Apple is behind Google in terms of hardware development. The UI flows as one would expect, but the resolution choices and (icon) support for a 7" tablet seem more rushed than usual. Even the name seems rushed.

Apple has had worse luck competing with Google Maps than introducing the Mini -- which argues against the idea that content is always less problematic in the App Store than in Google Play.

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Old 01-21-2013, 02:56 PM   #73
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Just curious, what iPhone and iPod do you have? Your list says iPad mini, iPad 2 -- and you wouldn't necessarily notice any difference between those two, the screen being similarly bad on both. Unless you've been a regular user of an iPhone 4+ or the equivalent iPod touch, the advantages of Retina screens might not be as readily discernible for you as for those users whose eyes have grown used to that quality and sharpness associated with Retina displays.

And, of course, everyone's mileage may differ. I'm typing this post on a MacBook Air, with iPad 3 open right next to it on the desk... and the difference in the quality of display, in favour of iPad 3, seems striking even to the naked eye at a casual glance.

PS: Just noticed on page 1 of this thread you used to have an iPad 3. Well, that's interesting.
I have the iPod touch 5th generation and I used the iPhone 4 for 2 years. I can tell the difference between the screen on my iPod and iPad mini, however I don't think the difference is that much. The retina display is nicer but the mini's display is good enough for me. It's not as terrible as was made out. It's a lot better than the screen on my galaxy tab 2 10.1 and slightly better than the nexus 7.
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Old 01-21-2013, 03:56 PM   #74
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I have the iPod touch 5th generation and I used the iPhone 4 for 2 years. I can tell the difference between the screen on my iPod and iPad mini, however I don't think the difference is that much. The retina display is nicer but the mini's display is good enough for me. It's not as terrible as was made out. It's a lot better than the screen on my galaxy tab 2 10.1 and slightly better than the nexus 7.
I would agree. There is more difference between the mini and the iPad 2 than the mini and a retina display. People look at the numbers and assume that the size difference in the numbers are related to how much better it is. There is a law of diminishing returns here. 134 to 160 ppi is noticeable if you look for it but beyond 160 requires hold the screen up to your face to really see much difference. Of course crispness does count for something but while reading you will not notice it much. Having said this it is true that this does not necessarily apply to everyone but then someone who needs 300 plus ppi can't necessarily assume everyone else should demand it just because they want it.

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Old 01-21-2013, 04:25 PM   #75
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It's a lot better than the screen on my galaxy tab 2 10.1 and slightly better than the nexus 7.
How so? The N7 has a DPI of 216, 33% higher than the mini.
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