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Old 06-30-2012, 07:14 AM   #1
Valec
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M92: Merging of Scribbles is unusable!

After updating to the 20120607 firmware, I still notice that the function for merging scribbles to pdf-files is still unusable. The merging function always looses far too many lines, especially exactly horizontal and exactly vertical lines.
Wouldn't it be possible to have a merge function which just does not smooth anything at all? The scribbles should be merged to the pdf just as they appear on the screen of the Onyx, pixel by pixel. Otherwise, one can never be sure that the scribbles are still readable.
Until this issue is fixed, the merging of scribbles is entirely useless.

Please fix that in the next firmware release!
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Old 06-30-2012, 09:56 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valec View Post
After updating to the 20120607 firmware, I still notice that the function for merging scribbles to pdf-files is still unusable. The merging function always looses far too many lines, especially exactly horizontal and exactly vertical lines.
Wouldn't it be possible to have a merge function which just does not smooth anything at all? The scribbles should be merged to the pdf just as they appear on the screen of the Onyx, pixel by pixel. Otherwise, one can never be sure that the scribbles are still readable.
Until this issue is fixed, the merging of scribbles is entirely useless.

Please fix that in the next firmware release!
I think it's actually only the perfectly horizontal and vertical lines that get missed. I'm glad to see that another user is also experiencing problems with this feature. I've been ranting on the forum on that issue for months . The other favorite topic of mine is the faulty power-management driver that stops the pen sometimes.

Look on the bright side, at least white is now merged as white! Booxtor is making sure these issues are on the to-do list of Onyx, i don't think he can do much more.

Last edited by por; 06-30-2012 at 10:03 AM.
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:31 PM   #3
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I can confirm that this is a very annoying issue that needs to be fixed as soon as possible. When you write words, and use "i", "l", "t" and other letters, eventually it's inevitable you will make a perfectly horizontal or vertical line, triggering this annoying issue.

I have some information that should help to solve this issue:
1. If you look at the merged PDF file on a computer, you will see that perfectly horizontal lines ARE there.
2. However, if you zoom in these horizontal lines on a computer, you'll notice that they are infinitely thin.
3. Thus, horizontal lines seem to be merged on in a way that does not account for the thickness of the line (similar to vector graphics in PDFs.
4. The problem isn't that the line isn't there. It's that it's infinitely thin. If you then convert this PDF (which does have horizontal lines) file into an image file, you'll notice that the horizontal line are now gone at normal zoom.
5. If you zoom into the image file, you'll see that the horizontal line is there but very thin and very faint.

So the problem seems to be that the PDF created by merging treats perfectly horizontal lines as an infinitely thin line. Thus, this is partly a display issue. Since the horizontal lines are in fact on the PDF file, a possible temporary workaround would be to make the M92 display these lines properly at normal zoom, like how a computer is able to.

Here's an alternative temporary fix that can be implemented: merging the scribble should create an image PDF, basically taking a screenshot, even if that causes, say, text to be no longer highlightable due to it being an image. E.g. the Scribble application exports to PNG, so it doesn't have any problems with horizontal lines. So merge PDF annotations by creating a PNG like the Scribble application, then convert the PNG to a PDF.

The permanent fix would be to give the horizontal lines thickness like all other lines and make the thin lines display properly like on a computer.

Let me know if you need some samples or screenshots.

Last edited by paralleluniverse; 01-10-2013 at 01:22 PM.
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Old 01-10-2013, 03:53 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paralleluniverse View Post
I can confirm that this is a very annoying issue that needs to be fixed as soon as possible. When you write words, and use "i", "l", "t" and other letters, eventually it's inevitable you will make a perfectly horizontal or vertical line, triggering this annoying issue.

I have some information that should help to solve this issue:
1. If you look at the merged PDF file on a computer, you will see that perfectly horizontal lines ARE there.
2. However, if you zoom in these horizontal lines on a computer, you'll notice that they are infinitely thin.
3. Thus, horizontal lines seem to be merged on in a way that does not account for the thickness of the line (similar to vector graphics in PDFs.
4. The problem isn't that the line isn't there. It's that it's infinitely thin. If you then convert this PDF (which does have horizontal lines) file into an image file, you'll notice that the horizontal line are now gone at normal zoom.
5. If you zoom into the image file, you'll see that the horizontal line is there but very thin and very faint.

So the problem seems to be that the PDF created by merging treats perfectly horizontal lines as an infinitely thin line. Thus, this is partly a display issue. Since the horizontal lines are in fact on the PDF file, a possible temporary workaround would be to make the M92 display these lines properly at normal zoom, like how a computer is able to.

Here's an alternative temporary fix that can be implemented: merging the scribble should create an image PDF, basically taking a screenshot, even if that causes, say, text to be no longer highlightable due to it being an image. E.g. the Scribble application exports to PNG, so it doesn't have any problems with horizontal lines. So merge PDF annotations by creating a PNG like the Scribble application, then convert the PNG to a PDF.

The permanent fix would be to give the horizontal lines thickness like all other lines and make the thin lines display properly like on a computer.

Let me know if you need some samples or screenshots.
Unfortunately, for some reason this issue doesn't seem to be a priority at the moment .
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Old 01-10-2013, 04:05 PM   #5
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If it is in Adobe pdf library, Adobe has to fix it, not Onyx.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:47 PM   #6
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If it is in Adobe pdf library, Adobe has to fix it, not Onyx.
I don't think it's a PDF issue.

It's an issue about how Onyx records scribbles on PDFs.

This should be fixable by Onyx, because the Scribble application doesn't have this problem, yet the PDF annotation does.

Last edited by paralleluniverse; 01-11-2013 at 04:39 AM.
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:26 AM   #7
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PDF is created by Adobe pdf library, I guess, and also rendering pdf to screen representation. If it is true, Onyx cannot do much about it.

But I found sort of the solution. Not perfect, but better than nothing.

If Onyx knows that there is this one or two bugs in Adobe they could go around in following way. Check if line is perfectly horizontal or vertical and if so make it not exactly vertical or horizontal by moving one of the ends 1 pixel. (Or they could cut the line to two sublines and missaalign the middlepoint, so that endpoints would be unmodified.)

It should not make any harm for long lines and be quite OK for short ones. It is better to have slightly modified line than no line.
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:03 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mono View Post
PDF is created by Adobe pdf library, I guess, and also rendering pdf to screen representation. If it is true, Onyx cannot do much about it.

But I found sort of the solution. Not perfect, but better than nothing.

If Onyx knows that there is this one or two bugs in Adobe they could go around in following way. Check if line is perfectly horizontal or vertical and if so make it not exactly vertical or horizontal by moving one of the ends 1 pixel. (Or they could cut the line to two sublines and missaalign the middlepoint, so that endpoints would be unmodified.)

It should not make any harm for long lines and be quite OK for short ones. It is better to have slightly modified line than no line.
This is definitely a problem with Onyx. Xournal (http://xournal.sourceforge.net/) is able to annotate PDFs. When you draw perfectly horizontal and vertical lines with xournal, and merge it with the PDF, it shows up visable and perfectly fine in the PDF.

This is uniquely a problem with how Onyx draws its annotations on PDFs. Other annotators do not have this problem.

In addition, the problem that the thin lines can't be viewed on M92 is also a problem unique to Onyx. For example the horizontal lines on the merged file created by Onyx are perfectly legible, like any other line, when viewed in normal zoom on a computer.

At this point, any temporary workaround, no matter how tacky, is definitely welcomed and will be much appreciated.

Last edited by paralleluniverse; 01-11-2013 at 07:07 AM.
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:07 PM   #9
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OK, if you think it is not Adobe library, it is your right.

Xournal does not use Adobe pdf library, so if things work in it it proves it can work. Nothing more nothing less.

If pdf is viewable on PC, but not in Onyx again proves nothing concerning Onyx x Adobe bug. Even if PC uses Adobe library, it will not be the same one like on Onyx reader.

There is possibility that Onyx programmers do something wrong using Adobe pdf library, but more probable is the bug in Adobe library.
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Old 01-11-2013, 08:58 PM   #10
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Annotation merging not working

Hi, I can't really add much to this conversation but it seems to me that you guys are able to see your merged sketches on pdfs on your PC. I just received my M92 yesterday, I updated it to 1.8.20121113 and installed the latest pdf reader UPD 2013.01.02. I have been trying for hours and cannot get merged annotations to appear when I view the files on my computer. All I was wanting to do was to be able to take lecture notes on a lined paper pdf and then upload the notes to my computer. When i merge annotations with a pdf, the M92 does create a new pdf and it looks fine on the device, other then the straight line issue, but when I view that pdf on the computer the annotations are gone. Any help would be much appreciated.
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Old 01-11-2013, 09:37 PM   #11
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So.. I answered my own question. You guys can view your merged sketches on your computers because the default pdf viewer for windows is usually adobe. Macs on the other hand use Preview which for some stupid apple reason does not support .Sketch files.

Ignore me, you may continue your argument/conversation. Personally I believe Onyx needs to fix the problem, they created the merge button, not adobe.
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Old 01-12-2013, 07:38 AM   #12
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Hi, I do not understand your problem. The sketches should be visible in any pdf viewer, not only Adobe on Win. I haven't heard anyone (except for you) claim that no sketches are visible after merging pdf and scribles.

This thread is about "feature" that exactly horizontal/vertical lines are close to invisible.

How do you merge pdf and scribles?
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Old 01-18-2013, 02:45 AM   #13
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I select the merge annotation button in the annotation menu.
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