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Old 11-13-2012, 07:18 AM   #121
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But when they are written as "apps", for the Metro UI these programs will run on both. And we can assume that most new programs will be written as apps.
I certainly do not assume that most programs will be written to target just the Windows RT API. ('Metro' apps). And I certainly think that the vast majority of existing programs (which is where Microsoft have the huge advantage over other OSs) will not be completely rewritten to use the WinRT APIs.
Unless the Windows RT tablets carve out a profitable niche reasonably quickly I think it is quite possible that developers (especially those targeting businesses) ignore it completely and continue to develop desktop apps.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:31 AM   #122
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I certainly do not assume that most programs will be written to target just the Windows RT API. ('Metro' apps). And I certainly think that the vast majority of existing programs (which is where Microsoft have the huge advantage over other OSs) will not be completely rewritten to use the WinRT APIs.
Unless the Windows RT tablets carve out a profitable niche reasonably quickly I think it is quite possible that developers (especially those targeting businesses) ignore it completely and continue to develop desktop apps.
A significant number will be converted. Many will not be. I didn't wait for the Surface Pro because it is heavier and the battery doesn't last as long, besides, my laptop still works great. And the while the Surface RT doesn't cover everything, it can do everything I want when I am on the road.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:42 AM   #123
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The head Windows guy got the ax at Microsoft. Buh bye
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:45 AM   #124
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Steven Sinofsky is another matter. One question is whether Microsoft's BoD will bring Windows 8 closer to creating tablet autonomy or cripple it further with imitative second thoughts.

Another question is whether that vast library of programs which runs on Windows 7 will still run on 8, let alone on later Pro tablets that might emerge once Microsoft grows resigned to falling back on that library.

Nintendo is a company that relies on a vast library to sell its devices, but its other strategies -- cutting costs and adding gimmicks to distract from the s-l-o-w progression of the hardware and software -- are antithetical to Microsoft, which revises software drastically, forgoes gimmicks, and emphasizes premium hardware apart from Windows' compatibility with nearly everything.

It seems to me that Microsoft could give us the perfect tablet OS. Google is about communication, ads and seeming to offer freedom as it locks you into permanent surveillance, and Apple is morphing back from its Linux-OS-X geek-friendliness to stopping the user from doing things directly as it did in the days of System 7. Whereas Microsoft could be creating the OS that makes tablets as powerful as they should be without compromising security, being pointlessly restrictive or dumbing them down in the name of privacy-free friendliness. Either that, or we could get back to the modular laptop I've always wanted (keyboard in one pouch of my satchel, display/PC in another), with no compromises whatsoever in performance or complexity.

Last edited by Prestidigitweeze; 11-13-2012 at 07:49 AM.
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:03 AM   #125
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Either that, or we could get back to the modular laptop I've always wanted (keyboard in one pouch of my satchel, display/PC in another), with no compromises whatsoever in performance or complexity.
Isn't that what the Samsung Ativ is?

Shari
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:34 AM   #126
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The head Windows guy got the ax at Microsoft. Buh bye
A good number of the staff is probably sighing in relief.
When the Apple iOS guy was canned last week, the buzz at CNET was the Sinofsky was just as "dificult" to work with and that he too might have worn out his welcome. So don't read too much into his exit...
It might even be voluntary. ("I got my bonus, my options are vested, I need a change of scenery...")
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:40 AM   #127
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Google is about communication, ads and seeming to offer freedom as it locks you into permanent surveillance
Because those Windows 8 apps would never, ever track everything you do in order to send you targeted ads.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:10 AM   #128
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Isn't that what the Samsung Ativ is?
Good question.

A more modern (and much less expensive) version of the Ativ with a fully vetted W8 and a 300 ppi screen might be closer to that. Aren't Samsung developing that line closely with MS anyway, and isn't Ativ simply the name which Samsung gives mobile devices that run a version of Windows?

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Because those Windows 8 apps would never, ever track everything you do in order to send you targeted ads.
Every OS I've used does compromise privacy to some degree with the exception of the update-discontinued Ubuntu I still use on my netbook (and which, Canonical and others are saying, can be ported to the Nexus 10).

But you'd have to be a slavering loyalist not to admit that Google's especially bad in that regard.

(Anyone on MR ought to be able to admit the drawbacks of their favorite devices and companies, and they ought to be able to do so without then being beaten to death by members of Team Not That Company.)

Whichever gadgets you choose involve particular compromises. That aspect of Google is the worst thing about the company (don't be evil, indeed), but everything else seems so good that people are willing to pretend Google is perfect.

Why would anyone choose an iPad over a Nexus 10 looking at specs, cost, customization and upgrade schedules? The screen's even made by the same company that confected the Retina. Apple's ecosystem's their ever-dwindling claim of superiority, but out of fairness, I might risk being even more unpopular on MR and add that an iPad owner potentially has more privacy than a stock Nexus 10 user.

On the nether hind, I own an Android phone currently and am considering the Nexus 10 myself, so if it's all right with you, Edward, I'd rather not get into a religious war about Google vs. MS and the back-and-forth deployment of the Great Cudgel.

I'm just wondering what will happen if Samsung does the same thing for the Surface in 2013 that it's just done for the Nexus 10 in 2012.

Last edited by Prestidigitweeze; 11-13-2012 at 10:17 AM.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:10 AM   #129
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Why not just go to their websites and play the flash versions? I do that for ARD and ZDF and both work without a hitch, even on Android right now.
Sure. But almost everything can be done via Web. Then we wouldn't need apps anyway for most jobs.
I prefer the convenience. And I prefer an optimised layout.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:15 AM   #130
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When the Apple iOS guy was canned last week, the buzz at CNET was the Sinofsky was just as "dificult" to work with and that he too might have worn out his welcome. So don't read too much into his exit...
That was my thinking.
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:09 PM   #131
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Sure. But almost everything can be done via Web. Then we wouldn't need apps anyway for most jobs.
I prefer the convenience. And I prefer an optimised layout.
This is why I feel the Chromebook will never really catch on in a big way.

Another part of that is that web apps only work when you have web access.
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:19 PM   #132
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This is why I feel the Chromebook will never really catch on in a big way.

Another part of that is that web apps only work when you have web access.
I plan on getting a Chromebook. I use my computer mostly for consumption - web surfing, email, paying bills, news, videos, games, etc. It's a recreational device.

Also, I only use my computer when it's connected to the internet. Turn the net off and I turn my computer off. To me, a computer is worthless without the net.

So I see no drawbacks to Chrome.
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:22 PM   #133
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I did the mistake of signing up for a new Live account when I installed 8 so after installing the 8 version of OneNote it automatically linked to the new account, hence previously cliff saved notebooks are no longer available.
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:56 PM   #134
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Good question.

A more modern (and much less expensive) version of the Ativ with a fully vetted W8 and a 300 ppi screen might be closer to that. Aren't Samsung developing that line closely with MS anyway, and isn't Ativ simply the name which Samsung gives mobile devices that run a version of Windows?
So you're saying that the $750 Ativ with 11.6" screen, keyboard, Win8 pro and smart pen isn't worth it because the screen isn't 300 ppi? What tablet screen available now IS 300 ppi?

Shari
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:37 PM   #135
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So you're saying that the $750 Ativ with 11.6" screen, keyboard, Win8 pro and smart pen isn't worth it because the screen isn't 300 ppi? What tablet screen available now IS 300 ppi?

Shari
Here's the example most people are talking about.

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The 300 ppi, 2,560-by-1,600 screen is the sharpest tablet screen out there, even besting the iPad's 2,048-by-1,536 Retina Display.

What seems unusually high spec'd in 2012 could easily become commonplace in 2013.

Quote:
Microsoft has already said that Windows 8 will support multiple display resolutions on tablets, with some of them even exceeding the levels set by Retina Display. Once again, reverting back to figures, Windows 8 will support a display of at least 2560 pixels by 1440 pixels at 291 ppi, and that too in a bigger 10.1-inch screen.
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