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Old 10-29-2012, 10:26 AM   #106
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Could someone try to explain this situation to me again? I'm too stupid to understand it, it seems.

Why does anyone care, or even has a supposed "right" to interfere, about what I do with a product I bought or licensed the use of a copy?

If I buy a cell phone, or a eBook reader - why should the original vendor have any right to know/control what I do with it?
I could use it to wipe my bottom and it would be none of their business.
They're not involved anymore - as long as I don't claim warranty or resell it.

I could see the problem if what I did would in any way involve them - like trying to jailbreak a device, brick it and try to get a refund.
But that's not the issue, is it?

I assume car manufacturers are going to make it illegal to drive cars outside certain countries? Or only use with unleaded, ethanol-free gas?
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Old 10-29-2012, 10:56 AM   #107
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The real problem is that the vendors are subsidizing the cost of the devices in anticipation of future revenues that are a consequence of your use. They are trying to prevent you from escaping the future expenditures.

It would be difficult for them to coerce a legislative body to act on this, so they invented this licensing issue.
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Old 10-29-2012, 11:07 AM   #108
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Please correct me if I am wrong, technically speaking, there has been no change for us whatsoever.

The DMCA has been around since 199. The exception regarding jailbreaking specifically targets smartphones. Tablets (of e-readers, if you consider them tablets) were never part of the exception. Rooting tablets has always been a DMCA violation - if copyrighted code was used and shared. To me, things are as they were yesterday, and the day before that.
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Old 10-29-2012, 11:49 AM   #109
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Very interesting. I wonder if the new Surface tablet is applicable in some way. Is it a comptuer of a tablet. What about the Galaxy Note? Poor definitions will only cause confusion here, beyond the rediculous nature of it to begin with.
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Old 10-29-2012, 12:08 PM   #110
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I would imagine the only companies that would make use of this are those with locked down ecosystems. I can't see Acer, for ex, caring much - if anything it saves them support costs when the warranty is voided by rooting.

Granted, the largest players are those who also sell / control content, but as I can access all my Amazon content on my tablet quite easily and legally, I don't need a Fire to use the ecosystem anyway. iOS is the platform with no other options in terms of alternate hardware, but the majority of my iFriends aren't interested in jail breaking their devices anyway, and I wager that is true for the majority of users.

The devices most likely to be jailbroken or rooted are those which are partially subsidized by projected future purchases, like the Nook or Fire. But I can't see amazon sending people to jail. The backlash would be immense if they did. B&N are an unknown now that they are partnering with MS. Not sure how they would proceed.

So, while I'm not pleased with any of this, reality (combined with the fact that they can't decide what a tablet actually is) seems to be that this is mostly language meant to dissuade via criminalization. It relies on the companies themselves to use the correct TOS / license language and to monitor their respective ecosystems for hardware in violation of that language and then initiate action against one of their customers. I suspect few would.

I suspect Google may be modifying their partner agreement soon. Just a hunch.
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Old 10-29-2012, 12:24 PM   #111
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Old 10-29-2012, 03:29 PM   #112
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I would like to know who "advised" the Librarian of Congress about this. And also what this means for people not in the US.

Okay, as others have said, if you tinker with your equipment and break it, too bad.

But for the Librarian to issue this degree .... Well again, on what did he base this decision?

I happen to work at the Library of Congress. We are supposed to be the bestest library ever, ever, ever in the world, but in my experience when it comes to tech, we rather lag behind. Even if we did decide to archive Twitter, lol.

I will not hesitate to tinker with any future devices I buy, if possible.
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Old 10-29-2012, 06:21 PM   #113
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I will not hesitate to tinker with any future devices I buy, if possible.
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Old 11-01-2012, 08:59 PM   #114
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I'm going off on a slight tangent, but maybe someone could set me straight on a thought here.............

If I didn't buy the device, and I only have the license to use it, then there should be no warranty expiry. The device is still theirs and if something goes wrong, they should fix it regardless of how long I owned it.

Am I off base here?

Last edited by gridlewak; 11-02-2012 at 06:28 AM.
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Old 11-02-2012, 08:33 AM   #115
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I'm going off on a slight tangent, but maybe someone could set me straight on a thought here.............

If I didn't buy the device, and I only have the license to use it, then there should be no warranty expiry. The device is still theirs and if something goes wrong, they should fix it regardless of how long I owned it.

Am I off base here?
The physical device is yours. It's software is theirs.
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Old 11-02-2012, 02:11 PM   #116
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Actually, gridlewak, I rather like your logic.

If they own the firmware and software, then why shouldn't they be responsible for the effect of updates gone wrong, especially if stability's damaged or features which might have influenced one's purchasing decision are removed or changed?

That argument might sound far-fetched, but if it benefited the companies that make our devices, it would have been presented in court long ago.
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Old 11-02-2012, 02:33 PM   #117
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I'm going off on a slight tangent, but maybe someone could set me straight on a thought here.............

If I didn't buy the device, and I only have the license to use it, then there should be no warranty expiry. The device is still theirs and if something goes wrong, they should fix it regardless of how long I owned it.

Am I off base here?
Yes. It's no different than when a business buys a system. Typically there are maintenance plans sold if you want ongoing support. Until the system is no longer supported, then support simply ends. Nothing is supported forever.

Apple does sell extra support, do they not? Same thing, they spell it out to you up front.
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Old 11-02-2012, 04:26 PM   #118
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Nothing is supported forever.
Quite right. Once a device is no longer supported, I may just buy a new device. Very lucrative for every device maker. Bad for the environment, maybe, but who cares. Seriously - consider CyanogenMod for Android systems. If I were no longer allowed to install the ROM of my choosing, my device would have been outdated for a long time. I wish Greenpeace and co had a say in these matters.
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Old 11-02-2012, 06:37 PM   #119
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I wish Greenpeace and co had a say in these matters.
By corporate logic and decree, the Earth has unlimited resources and can support infinite greed.
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Old 11-02-2012, 07:21 PM   #120
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By corporate logic and decree, the Earth has unlimited resources and can support infinite greed.
Unfortunately, this is very true and applies to all cooperation worldwide. One of my favorite quotes:

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The point is, ladies and gentleman, that greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right, greed works. Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Greed, in all of its forms; greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge has marked the upward surge of mankind.
Gordon Gekko in Wall Street (1987)
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