Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-22-2012, 07:21 AM   #166
tompe
Grand Sorcerer
tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,146
Karma: 4315826
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Linköpng, Sweden
Device: Nexus 7, Nexus 5, iPad 2, Kindle PW
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveEisenberg View Post
This is semantics. I think that by now you know what copyright advocates mean when they use the word piracy. And you advocate changing the law to allow it.
Most people here seems to think that if it is legal it is OK and will not call it piracy then.
tompe is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 07:12 PM   #167
speakingtohe
Wizard
speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.speakingtohe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 4,639
Karma: 25362262
Join Date: Apr 2010
Device: sony PRS-T1 and T3, Kobo Mini and Aura HD, Tablet
Lots of things are legal that are not OK, lying and cheating for example.

Helen
speakingtohe is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 07:48 PM   #168
Ninjalawyer
Guru
Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ninjalawyer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Ninjalawyer's Avatar
 
Posts: 823
Karma: 18464912
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Device: Kobo Touch, Nexus 7 (2013)
Quote:
Originally Posted by speakingtohe View Post
Lots of things are legal that are not OK, lying and cheating for example.

Helen
And lots of things that are not okay should not be illegal per your example.
Ninjalawyer is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 07:51 PM   #169
Kolenka
<Insert Wit Here>
Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kolenka's Avatar
 
Posts: 973
Karma: 1254645
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Puget Sound
Device: Sony T2, Kindle Paperwhite
Quote:
Originally Posted by speakingtohe View Post
Lots of things are legal that are not OK, lying and cheating for example.

Helen
The act of criminalizing behavior, and the ethics of that behavior are distinct issues for good reason. Partly because a reason of ethics is a poor reason to criminalize a behavior. It is a weird concept, but important if you want society to function rather than tear itself apart.

Specific ethics vary from person to person, and they evolve over time. And many ethics have little to do with how well the society functions at the large scale. Codifying too much of that into law is a recipe for a dogmatic, irrational, and dysfunctional society/government.

But here's the thing, lying and cheating can pose a problem to society. Specifically when it is easy to go back on your word in a business deal with no recourse. Thus, we include the legal concept of a contract that is enforced by civil courts. So while we don't criminalize the behavior, we make it possible to address the harm the behavior causes to society.

Copyright infringement started out purely as a civil offense, rather than criminal. I'm not a fan of how it has been made into a criminal offense. I believe the protections afforded under copyright fall under the same category that contract law provides. Not the same protections that criminal law is meant to provide.
Kolenka is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 08:16 PM   #170
SteveEisenberg
Wizard
SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,783
Karma: 12414006
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia USA
Device: Kindle Keyboard 3G
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggleton View Post
I am certain that most books are written by one person, with perhaps a few friends doing some pre-publication reads.
Why?

I realize that purely imaginative literature has a predominant presence on this board. But were you considering, when you became certain of the one-person hypothesis, that non-fiction is arguably more popular than fiction?

As far as translators are concerned, your one person hypothesis may be partly due to the provincialism of English speakers. We tend to read books originally written in our own language. Look at how the number one through seven German fiction bestsellers on my last link were all translations.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggleton View Post
Everything else is just business, garbage from the past millennia that needs to be taken out.
Editors are garbage? Now people are going to think you're a Stalinist again.
SteveEisenberg is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 08:49 PM   #171
Jozawun
Evangelist
Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Jozawun's Avatar
 
Posts: 490
Karma: 1597460
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Australia
Device: Cybook Gen 3, Pocketbook 902, Sony 650
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveEisenberg View Post

Editors are garbage? Now people are going to think you're a Stalinist again.
Anybody who thinks Giggles is a Stalinist needs their head read.
Or, more likely, has Reds in their head.
Jozawun is offline  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:14 PM   #172
SteveEisenberg
Wizard
SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SteveEisenberg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,783
Karma: 12414006
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia USA
Device: Kindle Keyboard 3G
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolenka View Post
Copyright infringement started out purely as a civil offense, rather than criminal.
I believe you are right.

'Criminal copyright infringement' has been part of our [United States] jurisprudence for over a century. And of course the US is a lot older than that.

My last link notes that some forms of copyright infringement became, in 1982, in the US, felonies. That's way harsher than is wise. When laws are so harsh, against offenses so common, they aren't enforced. Make it like a parking ticket. Give the kingpins probation.
SteveEisenberg is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 03:49 AM   #173
Kumabjorn
Basculocolpic
Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kumabjorn's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,065
Karma: 20131415
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Sweden
Device: Kindle 3 WiFi, Kindle 4SO, Kindle for Android, Sony PRS-350 and PRS-T1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jozawun View Post
Anybody who thinks Giggles is a Stalinist needs their head read.
Or, more likely, has Reds in their head.
Would Ayn Rand be an example of the most extremist libertarian?
If so is Giggles a Randy eBook lover?
Kumabjorn is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 04:47 AM   #174
Jozawun
Evangelist
Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jozawun ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Jozawun's Avatar
 
Posts: 490
Karma: 1597460
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Australia
Device: Cybook Gen 3, Pocketbook 902, Sony 650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kumabjorn View Post
Would Ayn Rand be an example of the most extremist libertarian?
If so is Giggles a Randy eBook lover?
Rand denounced libertarianism, loved property rights and adored copyright.
I feel this means no meeting of minds between her and Giggles.

Which is not to say that the answer to your second question is "no".
Jozawun is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 06:46 PM   #175
whitearrow
Guru
whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 754
Karma: 2155110
Join Date: Apr 2008
Device: Kindle 3G/WiFi
If anyone is interested in reading about the actual case the court will be deciding, there is a good explanation of the basic issues here.

Interestingly, Justice Kagan, who recused herself the last time this issue came up, leading to a 4-4 affirmance of the circuit court's decision, will be the deciding vote.

Last edited by whitearrow; 10-23-2012 at 06:49 PM.
whitearrow is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 08:10 PM   #176
Giggleton
Suspended
Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,687
Karma: 4368191
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Oregon
Device: Kindle3
The time of tariffs has passed.

What country who prints currency does not by definition manipulate currency? All countries should therefore be suspect, as well as their legislative decisions, it is only logical.

This book can only be sold in the country where it was bought? lol, what an archaic notion.

I am interested in this case, but I am also not interested in the idea that the supreme court should have the final say in any matter, so I'm a bit torn...

Last edited by Giggleton; 10-23-2012 at 08:13 PM.
Giggleton is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 08:32 PM   #177
whitearrow
Guru
whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.whitearrow ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 754
Karma: 2155110
Join Date: Apr 2008
Device: Kindle 3G/WiFi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggleton View Post
I am also not interested in the idea that the supreme court should have the final say in any matter, so I'm a bit torn...
It doesn't actually matter if you're interested. At the moment, the Supreme Court does have the final say, whether you choose to recognize it or not.

This is, however, a matter of statutory interpretation, not constitutional law, so Congress could always change it at a later time.
whitearrow is offline  
Old 10-23-2012, 09:01 PM   #178
Kolenka
<Insert Wit Here>
Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kolenka's Avatar
 
Posts: 973
Karma: 1254645
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Puget Sound
Device: Sony T2, Kindle Paperwhite
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggleton View Post
The time of tariffs has passed.

What country who prints currency does not by definition manipulate currency? All countries should therefore be suspect, as well as their legislative decisions, it is only logical.

This book can only be sold in the country where it was bought? lol, what an archaic notion.
I'm not really sure how tariffs and devaluing one's currency to make exports more palatable have anything to do with the topic at hand here. Beyond maybe the fact that currencies are of inequal value, and regions have inequal costs of living, creating the situation of arbitrage that took place here. Ending currency manipulation will not end that, ending tariffs won't end that, and tariffs do still provide a useful service that has nothing to do with the issue at hand.

Archaic notion? Maybe. Reality? Yes. The problem here is that you don't have a world government, world currency or really any organization at that level which can properly level the playing field. Each nation has different laws. Each nation has tariffs on imports (see Brazil's 100% tariffs making Foxconn build plants there to bypass it). As long as you have all these different sovereign nations with their own idea of what is moral and legal behavior, you cannot get a truly global economy. At least not one that is less neurotic than what we have now. If you haven't realized how neurotic the global economy is by now, you haven't worked at a company that operates internationally, or have been ignoring the economy section of the newspaper for the last 50 years.
Kolenka is offline  
Old 10-24-2012, 09:23 AM   #179
Giggleton
Suspended
Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Giggleton ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,687
Karma: 4368191
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Oregon
Device: Kindle3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolenka View Post
I'm not really sure how tariffs and devaluing one's currency to make exports more palatable have anything to do with the topic at hand here. Beyond maybe the fact that currencies are of inequal value, and regions have inequal costs of living, creating the situation of arbitrage that took place here. Ending currency manipulation will not end that, ending tariffs won't end that, and tariffs do still provide a useful service that has nothing to do with the issue at hand.

Archaic notion? Maybe. Reality? Yes. The problem here is that you don't have a world government, world currency or really any organization at that level which can properly level the playing field. Each nation has different laws. Each nation has tariffs on imports (see Brazil's 100% tariffs making Foxconn build plants there to bypass it). As long as you have all these different sovereign nations with their own idea of what is moral and legal behavior, you cannot get a truly global economy. At least not one that is less neurotic than what we have now. If you haven't realized how neurotic the global economy is by now, you haven't worked at a company that operates internationally, or have been ignoring the economy section of the newspaper for the last 50 years.
At least we recognize what the problem is, if the global economy is insane, aren't those who continue to allow it to function crazy as well??
Giggleton is offline  
Old 10-24-2012, 11:22 AM   #180
Kolenka
<Insert Wit Here>
Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kolenka ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kolenka's Avatar
 
Posts: 973
Karma: 1254645
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Puget Sound
Device: Sony T2, Kindle Paperwhite
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggleton View Post
At least we recognize what the problem is, if the global economy is insane, aren't those who continue to allow it to function crazy as well??
Again, you keep missing my key point here, and inserting different words that don't mean what I say.

Neurotic != insane, and was a form of hyperbole to refer to how twitchy nations are in the global economy.

The point I keep making and that you routinely ignore is that nobody is "allowing" the global economy to function. Nobody has any level of control over it. Nations try to control their piece of it, and the differences that make the global economy look neurotic are due to cultural differences as well as differences in the local situation.

You can't just "fix" culture so that it is all the same and reshape whole economies to "fix" local situations. It's not realistic to believe that can just be done. Not when these different cultures look at each other and ask themselves "Why do they do that?"
Kolenka is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Government Supreme Court Decision regarding the Affordable Care Act Dulin's Books Other Books 0 06-30-2012 04:09 PM
US Supreme Court mentions Kindle Madam Broshkina Amazon Kindle 9 03-26-2009 11:30 AM
Supreme Court Rules Against Grokster Bob Russell Lounge 2 06-28-2005 02:16 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:58 PM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.