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Old 10-12-2012, 05:18 AM   #31
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yeah, tough break.

Demo's can be made to "work", yes indeed.

Glad you got the bottom of it.
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Old 10-12-2012, 06:51 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Popup View Post
OK, I played a bit more.

I charged the battery with 400mA for a couple of hours, then disconnected it and left it overnight. This morning it still showed 4.15V.

I plugged it back in the kindle and the green LED lit up. It booted and went all the way to the 'home screen'! The battery indicator showed 'full' and everything looked OK. Then I picked it up to reassemble the back, and it froze.
Sorry for asking an obvious question, only asking because sometimes the obvious gets over-looked . . . .

You did use the two "washer like" bits of formed metal between the battery and the battery's screw hubs?

They are more than just "spacers", they make a ground connection between the board's ground plane and the back of the display frame.

It looks as if that connection could be very intermittent if they where not used, enough to shift when the device was picked up.

- - - - or - - - -

question: "Dr., Dr., It hurts right here when I press hard!"
ans: "So don't press there!"
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Old 10-12-2012, 07:21 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by knc1 View Post
Sorry for asking an obvious question, only asking because sometimes the obvious gets over-looked . . . .

You did use the two "washer like" bits of formed metal between the battery and the battery's screw hubs?

They are more than just "spacers", they make a ground connection between the board's ground plane and the back of the display frame.
Very good question indeed...

They were definitely there the first couple of times that I disassembled/reassembled it. I don't think that I've lost them, but I'd better check!
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Old 10-12-2012, 07:32 AM   #34
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I just checked, and they're still there.
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Old 10-12-2012, 09:15 AM   #35
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I just checked, and they're still there.
So after the next recovery, don't pick it up.
- - - -
Seriously, I was looking at it but can not see how the board would be stressed by picking it up (or turning it over) at any point other than where the frame, board and battery are clamped together by the battery screws.

It almost had to be face up when it was running for you to report the changes in the screen.
It almost had to be face down to install the battery or to start putting the back on it.

The board is looks like it is held to the frame by at least nine screws, and the frame is just not that flexible.
That plus the two screws holding the light switch / serial port connector in place.

Did you remove the board from the frame during the inspection and attempts to clean?
Did all of the microscopic connectors get properly seated when reassembling?

Note: The screw next to the mini-PCIe connector also has one of those formed "ground clips" under it.

Check also in the area around those two light connectors (the top "tab" is the power, the bottom one is the sensor tabs and serial port connection).

That screw on lower port connection is in two parts, did it get opened and perhaps closed again with either the sensor contact or the Rx contact shorted to ground?
(Ground is in-between those two pads.)

- - - -

Mechanical error seems much more likely than a micro-crack in the board, at least not the way this board is fastened to the relatively ridged frame.

Last edited by knc1; 10-12-2012 at 09:18 AM.
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Old 10-12-2012, 09:42 AM   #36
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I tried to connect an external power supply instead of the battery, but with very limited results. As mentioned above, it keeps consuming power (~120-130mA) but without any on-screen activity. (For at least fifteen minutes.)
That actually sounds quite normal - if the system is busy with one of its background tasks, such as rotating log files or indexing books.

If during all of this you made any changes to the contents of the user storage partition (the one you see over the usb cable - A.K.A: /mnt/us) it is very possible that the indexer is running.

That run time can be long, and if it hits one of the publications that it can not index, it is known to get stuck in a loop.

Suggestion: Empty the USB storage area (to be certain you don't have a "bad book") - re-boot.
Expect it to actually go to sleep within a few minutes of the screen indicating it is "asleep" (it isn't, not when the screen is first shown).
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Old 10-12-2012, 09:53 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knc1 View Post
Did you remove the board from the frame during the inspection and attempts to clean?
Nope.
Quote:
Did all of the microscopic connectors get properly seated when reassembling?
I hope so! (In fact I didn't remove any of the cables. I was pushing them around a bit, believing that it could have been a bad connection in either of them, but I believe that they're all firmly seated now.


Quote:
Note: The screw next to the mini-PCIe connector also has one of those formed "ground clips" under it.
?Which is the mini-PCIe connector? Is it the one on 'top right'? There's something on the edge there that looks like a mini-PCIe, but there's nothing connected. Is this where the GSM unit goes on the 3G version? (I've got the wifi-only.)

Quote:
Check also in the area around those two light connectors (the top "tab" is the power, the bottom one is the sensor tabs and serial port connection).

That screw on lower port connection is in two parts, did it get opened and perhaps closed again with either the sensor contact or the Rx contact shorted to ground?
(Ground is in-between those two pads.)
I haven't taken that apart (yet) but maybe I should. There could be something stuck in there...


Quote:
Mechanical error seems much more likely than a micro-crack in the board, at least not the way this board is fastened to the relatively ridged frame.
Yes, I agree that the PCB seems reasonably well protected, but I can't think of anything else. Although I suppose that a poorly soldered BGA could also be at fault. That can be a bugger to troubleshoot, and can give this kind of errors...
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Old 10-12-2012, 09:57 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by knc1 View Post
That actually sounds quite normal - if the system is busy with one of its background tasks, such as rotating log files or indexing books.

If during all of this you made any changes to the contents of the user storage partition (the one you see over the usb cable - A.K.A: /mnt/us) it is very possible that the indexer is running.
Fifteen minutes sounds rather excessive though. I did a 'factory reset' not long ago (when the problem first appeared) and I've only got two books on the device.

And it did recognize those books when it booted this morning. Until I picked it up to pop the back on again...

I think I'll put it aside for a couple of days now. (With the battery removed in order not to drain it in case the CPU is stuck in an exception loop or equivalent.)
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Old 10-12-2012, 01:26 PM   #39
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Yes, top right of the board.
If you don't have the 3G model, then you might not even have the connector.

Most of my questions were based on the thought that the motherboard had been removed.
If you haven't removed it, then those questions don't matter.

Yes, the frame is fairly ridged, it has to be so the push buttons on the sides can be pushed.

It would be nice to have the serial port connected, just to see what messages the kernel is putting out and if there is a "panic" loop being entered.

We know (from the De-brick a DX(G) thread) that the kernel in the 2.5.8 firmware build has an error in the "panic halt" function that causes it to loop rather than halt.
Could be the same problem in the kernel of the 3.xx firmware also. I don't know, I haven't looked at the code.

That DX(G) is sitting without its battery installed, waiting for me to finish learning how to re-cover it.
Those DX(G) machines are a bit too expensive to just toss in the trash without making a major effort to fix it.
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Old 10-12-2012, 04:36 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by knc1 View Post
Yes, top right of the board.
If you don't have the 3G model, then you might not even have the connector.
No, no connector, but there's the footprint.
Quote:
It would be nice to have the serial port connected, just to see what messages the kernel is putting out and if there is a "panic" loop being entered.
It would indeed. How does one attach a serial port? I suppose it requires some soldering, but that's not the end of the world.
(I might not have much time in the near future, but it would indeed be an interesting project. In my day-job I work a lot with low-level debugging of embedded CPUs, but I'm more involved in the software side of things.)
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Old 10-12-2012, 04:56 PM   #41
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No, no connector, but there's the footprint.
It would indeed. How does one attach a serial port? I suppose it requires some soldering, but that's not the end of the world.
(I might not have much time in the near future, but it would indeed be an interesting project. In my day-job I work a lot with low-level debugging of embedded CPUs, but I'm more involved in the software side of things.)
There is no serial port connector after you remove the connector from touching the serial port pads, but when properly assembled and closed, there is an external serial port connector on a K3. It is in the lower slot on the left edge. You do not need to open it to access the serial port. You need a plug to fit it:
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99177

It may be quicker to open it and solder to the pads for those serial pins if you are in a hurry.

EDIT: Of course, the serial port pads that the serial port connector touches on the board ARE on the upper right of the board as knc1 said if you hold your kindle upside down.

Last edited by geekmaster; 10-12-2012 at 05:02 PM.
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:00 PM   #42
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No soldering required.

I have not finished my "household items" LV serial connector thread but the first post has a link to the previous connector tab.
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=170566

Finishing that connector (and the thread describing how to make it) is at the top of my to-do list right now.

I now need it for both my own K3 and for finishing up the 'debrick a DX' thread.
(The serial port is the only way to communicate with the boot loader.)

Last edited by knc1; 10-12-2012 at 05:09 PM.
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:05 PM   #43
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No soldering required.

I have not finished my "household items" LV serial connector thread but the first post has a link to the previous connector tab.

Finishing that connector (and the thread describing how to make it) is at the top of my to-do list right now.

I now need it for both my own K3 and for finishing up the 'debrick a DX' thread.
(The serial port is the only way to communicate with the boot loader.)
Like these "household items"?
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho....php?p=1919310



The DX uses a different connector than the K3.
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