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Old 07-17-2012, 08:12 PM   #16
tubemonkey
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Apparently, monkeys can only focus on bananas and micro SD card slots.
...and these

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Old 07-17-2012, 09:17 PM   #17
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...and these

But would you pay $200 for that?
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Old 07-17-2012, 10:28 PM   #18
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Fair enough, but I suspect that people who already dropped $200 on a tablet in the last 7 months aren't the target market.

The question is, if you didn't have your Fire, would you spend your $200 on the Nexus or a Fire? What makes the Nexus the "Kindle Killer" is that, at least for now, it does have better specs and I suspect more people will choose it over the Fire. The specs may not be enough for you to want to upgrade, but they are good enough to sway people.

I suspect most Fire owners are happy with what they have, and not only will they not switch to the Nexus, they probably won't upgrade to whatever the Fire is replaced by unless it is a significant jump in specs. I was one of many who bought the First Gen iPad, skipped the 2nd Generation and then upgrade to the 3rd. Only true hardcore gadget people upgrade every generation.
I think you hit the nail on the head. I don't think many KF owners will run out and get the N7 (unless they're the type to run out and get the latest, greatest thing).

I'm happy with my KF, but if I was in the market right now, I'd be inclined to get the N7.
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Old 07-18-2012, 12:13 AM   #19
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The number one area where the Kindle fire fails me is being locked into the Amazon app store. I know there are ways to sideload apps or even use alternative app stores but I do not want to have to hack *my* reader/tablet just to do what I want with it.
You don't have to hack anything on the Kindle Fire to install apps or alternative markets. It's already set up to install non amazon apps. You just enable it in settings. You're not locked into anything with the Kindle Fire. It's just more of a convenience to use Amazon services than others due to the UI.

Epubs can be easily read on the KF by sideloading an eReader app like Mantano or Aldiko. You can even easily put the Nook app on your Fire and buy from B&N if you want. I have Kobo on mine since I accidentally bought a book that is only accessible through their app. No hacking is needed unless you want Google stuff on there. I'm not rooted you just enable the 3rd party apps in settings and install whatever you need.
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Old 07-18-2012, 01:47 AM   #20
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The Tablet wars remind me of the Search and Browser wars post Y2K and this next year is going to be very confusing for the $300 or less tablet/eReader/iPod buyer. Everyone has something on the market but no one company is offering the end user a 100% solution. After much pain and product flops his market will eventually level out with plenty of options available for 90% of the market.

Apple and the cell industry did a great job of conditioning users to like what they got regardless. It appears that even Apple is going to dive into the 7" market with either a really big Touch or a really small iPad. Either way Apple will end up setting benchmarks the rest of the industry will struggle to match.

Amazon threw a huge monkey wrench into the tablet market by proving that most buyers will go for content rich, simplified, user friendly devices driven by locked down older technology. I picked up a KF because it was inexpensive and I had a few gift cards from the holidays. It has served me well as an e-reader / internet appliance. Amazon got a whole lot of things right but the User Experience suffers for the lack of a decent centralized sync point to get non-amazon, user content, on and off the device.

Google beat the industry to market with the next generation model and may have cracked the paradigm. Not a bad move from a marketing stand point since they will be in full blown production and on the shelves with accessories for the "Back To School" shopping season. They managed to undercut the impact of any KF upgrade into an "Us Too" press release. Google also applied max pressure on Apple by laying down a pretty impressive $200 price point for a high quality device.

The remaining 10% will of course continue to help the industry push forward by demanding SD slots, better batteries, Dolby Surround, HDMI and more pixels.
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Old 07-18-2012, 01:51 AM   #21
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But would you pay $200 for that?
Only if it had a micro Star Trek replicator built-in

monkey: Banana, Chiquita, peeled

monkey: Tablet, Nexus 7, w/ card slot
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Old 07-18-2012, 02:01 AM   #22
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Apple and the cell industry did a great job of conditioning users to like what they got regardless. It appears that even Apple is going to dive into the 7" market with either a really big Touch or a really small iPad. Either way Apple will end up setting benchmarks the rest of the industry will struggle to match.
If they go the big iPod touch route, they won't be setting any benchmarks; since the touch has weak hardware compared to smartphones. Apple needs to go the mini iPad route.

Last edited by tubemonkey; 07-18-2012 at 02:32 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 07-18-2012, 12:51 PM   #23
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I have had two Apple MacBook Pros with Bluetooth, location services (kinda like GPS, but not), and microphones. Of course, both of my iPhones have had these features too. However, I have never had any use for them. I have a bluetooth mouse, but I rarely use it because I have come to the realization that my trackpad works better. You will find sooner or later that the only good reason for a keyboard on a tablet is when you need to type papers/edit code, and the only use for a game controller is when you are using it with a bigger screen and not a lousy 7 to 10 inch one.
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Old 07-18-2012, 02:00 PM   #24
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"I have had two Apple MacBook Pros with Bluetooth, location services (kinda like GPS, but not), and microphones. Of course, both of my iPhones have had these features too. However, I have never had any use for them. I have a bluetooth mouse, but I rarely use it because I have come to the realization that my trackpad works better."

Is not GPS for when one is traveling about the landscape and has a need for location based services?

Sort of pointless on a tablet Device limited to Wifi IMHO
and if you are tethered to a second 3g/4g phone then why not just run your GPS app on that device directly ??

Bluetooth is only needed for file transfer& wireless head phones
I personally would not use my 7 inch tablet as a walk around music player
there are smaller purpose built devices for that and much cheaper
And for file transfer I can get a USB to Micro USB cable for around $2 USD where I live.
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Old 07-18-2012, 03:08 PM   #25
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I have an Apple Bluetooth Keyboard and Trackpad, so I certainly have a use for Bluetooth on my Mac. The Keyboard is easily paired with my iPad and I have a case that holds both, so it is handy when I don't want to carry a full blown PC. I don't use it a lot, but it is handy and I'm sure it costs the manufacturer mere pennies to add.

GPS on a WiFi device may not be useful as a full blown navigator, but with so many of Google's services and other apps being location aware you really notice when GPS is missing. There are so many uses for a location aware tablet that are lost on the Fire in it's current form. It was one of the main reasons I returned mine.
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Old 07-18-2012, 06:27 PM   #26
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GPS on a WiFi device may not be useful as a full blown navigator,...
Just use offline maps (now available with Google Maps). After all, handheld and car mounted GPS devices use onboard maps for navigation.
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:59 PM   #27
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If you watch videos on Amazon Prime, my guess is you'll be SOL on the N7 as Prime has been fairly incompatible with Flash implementations on ICS (my experience with my Xoom tablet).

I saw an N7 today at work. Must admit that it is nice in how thin and light it is and the screen is very good looking.
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Old 07-18-2012, 10:11 PM   #28
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According to this: http://www.androidauthority.com/goog...tralia-101742/

All pre-ordered 8GB nexus 7's have been shipped, but the "accessorized" versions (such as the 16GB model that I ordered) will not start shipping until July 19.

(cross-posted because relevant to discussion in both threads)
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Old 07-19-2012, 02:32 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubemonkey View Post
If they go the big iPod touch route, they won't be setting any benchmarks; since the touch has weak hardware compared to smartphones. Apple needs to go the mini iPad route.
Steve Jobs said that Apple would never make a smaller iPad. Putting the new iTablet into the "Touch" family would preserve his wishes and re-energize a soon to be irrelevant product line. This could provide Apple a smoother upgrade path for non-iPhone users into the IOS.

In 2000 I had a Handspring Visor with the Eye module and cell phone module. It only took the cell phone industry 8 more years to catch up. Why? Because the tech and Ma Bell world had its collective head stuck in a paradigm.

I read an interview once with the designer of the original Palm Pilot which was the PDA grandfather of our smartphone culture. In it he described the design process. He carried mocked up prototypes around for weeks at a time until he came up with a form factor that fit in a shirt pocket. He talked about the design paradigm of Newspapers, Notebooks and Notepads. They chose to go after the pocket sized Notepad user because they generally tended to be the Doers, Thinkers and decision makers of the day.

They deliberately did not go after DayRunners and Franklin Planners because their product appeared to accentuate them. When Handspring introduced the Visor with its plug in module that allowed us to add functionality to a Palm device he users began to adapt, modify or abandon those pen and paper products to the new technology. Look around a meeting today, how many Franklin Planners do you see?

The 1st gen Kindle Fire allowed the target users to get their hands on an affordable, useable device to experiment with and beta test the next generation of tablets. The Nexus 7 looks amazing. Just like they were in the Amazon KF2 design meetings. Apple will have about 90 days to come up with some mind blowing features.
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Old 07-19-2012, 03:34 AM   #30
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If you watch videos on Amazon Prime, my guess is you'll be SOL on the N7 as Prime has been fairly incompatible with Flash implementations on ICS (my experience with my Xoom tablet).

I saw an N7 today at work. Must admit that it is nice in how thin and light it is and the screen is very good looking.
Amazon Prime videos run fine on my Touchpad under CM9. So you must have some other issues.
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