Is it time English adopt a genderless pronoun?

bigjantailor · 07-17-2012, 12:12 AM

I do a bit of technical writing and I can't stand the he/she or he or alternating he then she every other example. So want a genderless pronoun. How about you?

Have fun, Jan Tailor

gmw · 07-17-2012, 01:37 AM

How about it?

More seriously, doesn't they and their etc. cover most of the requirement? I came across this article recently: A singular use of they.

Harper Kingsley · 07-17-2012, 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmw

How about it?

More seriously, doesn't they and their etc. cover most of the requirement? I came across this article recently: A singular use of they.

Funny thing, I was thinking about this the other day. I was talking to my brother and realized for the first time that I use "they" and "their" in conversation when I don't know the sex of a person. It really opened my eyes and I actually thought about writing a blog post about it. Then I sobered up

and realized I didn't have enough material for a whole post.

SeaKing · 07-17-2012, 02:17 AM

It's always them what causes us problems.

murraypaul · 07-17-2012, 05:26 AM

Another vote for singular they.

VydorScope · 07-17-2012, 07:35 AM

Yeah, I am seeing "they" used more and more. I personally use it, as I think it is much cleaner then "he or she."

Of course there is always himer and shim

owly · 07-17-2012, 07:49 AM

The word "hen"=someone genderless/androgynous is being used more and more in Sweden. Otherwise it's "hon"=her and "han"=him.

teh603 · 07-17-2012, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owly

The word "hen"=someone genderless/androgynous is being used more and more in Sweden. Otherwise it's "hon"=her and "han"=him.

I've seen "hir" and "zir" used a fair bit. I'll be honest, though, I kinda prefer "they." It doesn't require us bringing more words into the vocabulary.

desertgrandma · 07-17-2012, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjantailor

I do a bit of technical writing and I can't stand the he/she or he or alternating he then she every other example. So want a genderless pronoun. How about you?

Have fun, Jan Tailor

Okay, so I'm not a writer of any kind, and perhaps I don't belong here.......however..........what the heck. You did say "have fun".

Aack. Since there are no "genderless" people that I know of, I do not want to read a "genderless" pronoun.

Now, I know there are a lot of people out there confused about their gender, I'm sure, but the "he/she" solution would work best for me and them.

murraypaul · 07-17-2012, 09:23 AM

Yuk, no need to make up nonsense words.
The correct English usage for something of definite but unknown gender is he.
However that is no longer socially acceptable (even though linguistically correct), and they is by far the best alternative.
So my answer to the poll would be: In practice, it already does

Antoinekamel · 07-17-2012, 02:57 PM

There is an ungendered manner of refering to she or he: "that person".

As murraypaul said, if you don't know, it' "he". Here in Brazil it's the same (portuguese language).

Bilbo1967 · 07-17-2012, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murraypaul

Yuk, no need to make up nonsense words.
The correct English usage for something of definite but unknown gender is he.
However that is no longer socially acceptable (even though linguistically correct), and they is by far the best alternative.
So my answer to the poll would be: In practice, it already does

Exactly what I wanted to say. I assume murraypaul is a male, but, just to be safe, they put it very well

frahse · 07-17-2012, 03:24 PM

When I first saw the heading, I thought that someone was seeking the answer to how we refer to transgenders.

There are now categories given on some checklists and
questionnaires like:

Sex/gender:
. other
. non-specified
. changeable
. "work in progress"
...

How do we, can we, or do we try to indicate these in a casual dialog, in a more formal dialog, and finally in a deterministic manner?

Do we end up seemingly trying to solidify a wisp of vapor.

QuantumIguana · 07-17-2012, 03:26 PM

The only thing correct about "he" is someone saying it is correct. Language changes. "He" is a holdover from when it could be assumed that that the person in question was male. It became increasingly illogical over time. "He or she" is clumsy, "s/he" is awkward at best, and how do you say it? "It" implies a thing rather than a person. We could adopt words like "zir", but that's not going to happen.

Singular "they" is here to stay, it's the most natural solution. It's not a new idea, it's been used as a singular for centuries.

StoryEnthusiast · 07-17-2012, 06:47 PM

In my technical translation work I tend to use "they" just to play safe.

View Poll Results: Do you want English to have a genderless pronoun?
No.	37	48.68%
He works for me.	7	9.21%
She works for me.	0	0%
He/she works for me	0	0%
Alternating he and she in example works for me.	1	1.32%
Yes.	31	40.79%
Voters: 76. You may not vote on this poll

07-17-2012, 12:12 AM	#1
bigjantailor Defender of Consciousness Posts: 69 Karma: 3323596 Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Vancouver Device: none	Is it time English adopt a genderless pronoun? I do a bit of technical writing and I can't stand the he/she or he or alternating he then she every other example. So want a genderless pronoun. How about you? Have fun, Jan Tailor Last edited by bigjantailor; 07-17-2012 at 12:17 AM.

07-17-2012, 07:35 AM	#6
VydorScope Wizard Posts: 2,594 Karma: 28692326 Join Date: Jun 2011 Device: Nook Color	Yeah, I am seeing "they" used more and more. I personally use it, as I think it is much cleaner then "he or she." Of course there is always himer and shim __________________ Vincent My Books on: Smashwords and Amazon My E-Book Series homepage: http://losttalesofpower.com All of my books are available DRM free through Smashwords.

07-17-2012, 09:23 AM	#10
murraypaul Interested Bystander Posts: 3,090 Karma: 7357565 Join Date: Jun 2008 Device: Sony PRS505, Nook Color(CM7), iPad3	Yuk, no need to make up nonsense words. The correct English usage for something of definite but unknown gender is he. However that is no longer socially acceptable (even though linguistically correct), and they is by far the best alternative. So my answer to the poll would be: In practice, it already does Last edited by murraypaul; 07-17-2012 at 09:27 AM.

07-17-2012, 03:24 PM	#13
frahse occasional author Posts: 1,131 Karma: 2014759919 Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Wandering God's glorious hills, valleys and plains. Device: Kindle3-3G, Archos 43	When I first saw the heading, I thought that someone was seeking the answer to how we refer to transgenders. There are now categories given on some checklists and questionnaires like: Sex/gender: . other . non-specified . changeable . "work in progress" ... How do we, can we, or do we try to indicate these in a casual dialog, in a more formal dialog, and finally in a deterministic manner? Do we end up seemingly trying to solidify a wisp of vapor. __________________ . Recognized? By Whom? Everyone. - "In The Shadow of Z'Ha'Dum"

07-17-2012, 01:37 AM	#2
gmw cacoethes scribendi Posts: 1,399 Karma: 62621233 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Australia Device: Sony650	How about it? More seriously, doesn't they and their etc. cover most of the requirement? I came across this article recently: A singular use of they.

07-17-2012, 02:17 AM	#4
SeaKing Frequent Flier Posts: 1,197 Karma: 2057399391 Join Date: Oct 2011 Device: KB kindle aboard, Galx Tab 7.0 Plus, trying out Droid 1 as mini-tab	It's always them what causes us problems.

07-17-2012, 05:26 AM	#5
murraypaul Interested Bystander Posts: 3,090 Karma: 7357565 Join Date: Jun 2008 Device: Sony PRS505, Nook Color(CM7), iPad3	Another vote for singular they.

07-17-2012, 07:49 AM	#7
owly Addict Posts: 392 Karma: 2217808 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Sweden Device: Kobo Glo, Sony PRS-T2	The word "hen"=someone genderless/androgynous is being used more and more in Sweden. Otherwise it's "hon"=her and "han"=him.

07-17-2012, 02:57 PM	#11
Antoinekamel Zealot Posts: 119 Karma: 1129463 Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Brazil Device: Kindle Paperwhite 5.3.4 and Kindle Touch 5.3.2.1	There is an ungendered manner of refering to she or he: "that person". As murraypaul said, if you don't know, it' "he". Here in Brazil it's the same (portuguese language).

07-17-2012, 03:26 PM	#14
QuantumIguana Wizard Posts: 1,449 Karma: 14424170 Join Date: Jan 2012 Device: Kindle	The only thing correct about "he" is someone saying it is correct. Language changes. "He" is a holdover from when it could be assumed that that the person in question was male. It became increasingly illogical over time. "He or she" is clumsy, "s/he" is awkward at best, and how do you say it? "It" implies a thing rather than a person. We could adopt words like "zir", but that's not going to happen. Singular "they" is here to stay, it's the most natural solution. It's not a new idea, it's been used as a singular for centuries.

07-17-2012, 06:47 PM	#15
StoryEnthusiast K. C. Lee Posts: 585 Karma: 3652522 Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: New Zealand Device: Android phone	In my technical translation work I tend to use "they" just to play safe. __________________ Golden Stories for mobile phones and tablets

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