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Old 05-09-2012, 10:46 AM   #1
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My m92 triggers shoplifiting alarm

I just wanted to let everyone know about one weird side effect of carrying m92 around. My faculty library is equipped with one of those supermarket style anti-shoplifiting systems which sound an alarm whenever a book is taken out without first being "disarmed". Now it turns out m92 triggers this alarm - I carried it in a notebook bag, it was off... And the effect is persistent, regardless of position of the device relative to system's gate.

This may sound stupid and all, but I don't really like attracting everyone's attention whenever I enter the library (let alone being strip-searched on every such occasion - some librarians are young and female but some quite the opposite ). And this is not going to be funny at all in a supermarket with real security.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:13 AM   #2
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There are several other electronic devices with the same problem. Only solution seems to be to take out the device before passing the detector and addressing somebody from the staff concerning this.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:41 PM   #3
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Or you can just turn the power off and completely shutdown your M92.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:44 PM   #4
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Or you can just turn the power off and completely shutdown your M92.
Very smart comment. Are you suggesting to remove the battery?

Because I have the same problem, and I tend to enter the library with my device(s) turned off, and my books closed.
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:11 PM   #5
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If it triggers the alarm obviously the detector reads some code. That code should show up in their logs. Ask whoever is managing the detector to put that code on the black list with. That should solve the problem for that particular location.
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Old 05-11-2012, 12:43 AM   #6
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the store and security don't have the power to check your bag nor search you just because the alarm goes off. So just ignore than and walk out like a boss.
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Old 05-11-2012, 12:49 AM   #7
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We were just talking about this the other day. It is amazing how strong the power of suggestion is. My best friend is a manager at a major grocery store chain and he was telling me how their new policy is to not even call the police if it is less than $25 in value because the local police will not even file a report. The conversation went on and I asked him how they ever catch anyone. They are store employees and not law enforcement in any way, so therefore they can't even touch a person even if they watch them pick something up and walk out the door. They can't bar the exit, that's illegal, so the best they could do is get the tag number. But, he says that nine times out of ten when they approach the person they might argue, but rarely have the sense to just keep on walking.
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Old 05-11-2012, 02:57 AM   #8
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They are store employees and not law enforcement in any way, so therefore they can't even touch a person even if they watch them pick something up and walk out the door. They can't bar the exit, that's illegal, so the best they could do is get the tag number. But, he says that nine times out of ten when they approach the person they might argue, but rarely have the sense to just keep on walking.
I assume you are from the States. There is something like citizen's arrest in many countries, as well as the US.

"A citizen's arrest is an arrest made by a person who is not acting as a sworn law-enforcement official.[1] In common law jurisdictions, the practice dates back to medieval Britain and the English common law, in which sheriffs encouraged ordinary citizens to help apprehend law breakers."


So I guess your friend just wants to avoid the hassle - which may be wise, considering small sums ...

In my country of residence the police will show up for .50 Cents worth of stolen goods if the shoplifter can't/won't identify themselves.
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Old 05-11-2012, 05:05 PM   #9
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A metal container may avoid the issue...also some shoplifting "professionals" use special bags shielded internally with aluminum foil to prevent alarms from triggering.

What about covering it with 2-3 turns of aluminum foil like a big sandwich? :-)

Just joking, sorry.... (thanks God it's Friday :-)
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Old 05-18-2012, 12:19 AM   #10
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I assume you are from the States. There is something like citizen's arrest in many countries, as well as the US.

"A citizen's arrest is an arrest made by a person who is not acting as a sworn law-enforcement official.[1] In common law jurisdictions, the practice dates back to medieval Britain and the English common law, in which sheriffs encouraged ordinary citizens to help apprehend law breakers."


So I guess your friend just wants to avoid the hassle - which may be wise, considering small sums ...

In my country of residence the police will show up for .50 Cents worth of stolen goods if the shoplifter can't/won't identify themselves.
Well, yes we are in the States. The trick here is that the laws are so oddly proportioned. Keep in mind that we have civil and legal issues at the same time. An example would be if you put booby trap in your home to stop a potential break-in. And this is documented and happened many times. So, someone breaks into your home and steps on a surprise bear trap. The trap breaks his ankle and holds him in place while you wake up and call the police. The police come and arrest him and he is tried and convicted by all legal terms. While in jail he can sue you for the medical bills, pain and suffering and all that good stuff and 9 times out of 10 will win.
Half of the time if someone is attacked and they fight back too harshly, both people are charged with assault. It is almost as if the legal system is afraid of the criminals themselves to the point of protecting them. God forbid a trained ex-military person like myself defend someone against a normal civilian.

So, in his case, if someone heads out the door with a package of steaks and he grabs them by the arm, they might go to jail, but they also have the option of suing him and the company for any claimed medical issues. Of course, the company would fire him and just throw some money at the person to shut them up.
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Old 05-18-2012, 12:48 AM   #11
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Quote:
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They are store employees and not law enforcement in any way, so therefore they can't even touch a person even if they watch them pick something up and walk out the door. They can't bar the exit, that's illegal, so the best they could do is get the tag number.
If they believe a crime has been committed--which it probably hasn't until the person has left the building--they can commit a citizen's arrest, and detain the person.

The difference between citizen's rights and police officers' is that, if the citizen is *wrong,* the person can sue them. If the cop is wrong, there's no recourse unless the cop can be proven to be acting from incompetence or malice. Just thinking someone was guilty when they were not is acceptable for cops to act on.

Details of citizen's arrests vary by state; you'd have to check those laws for details. But there is no state in the US that requires people to stand around and watch crimes being committed because the police are too far away or too busy to deal with them right now.
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Old 05-18-2012, 10:47 AM   #12
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If they believe a crime has been committed--which it probably hasn't until the person has left the building--they can commit a citizen's arrest, and detain the person.

The difference between citizen's rights and police officers' is that, if the citizen is *wrong,* the person can sue them. If the cop is wrong, there's no recourse unless the cop can be proven to be acting from incompetence or malice. Just thinking someone was guilty when they were not is acceptable for cops to act on.

Details of citizen's arrests vary by state; you'd have to check those laws for details. But there is no state in the US that requires people to stand around and watch crimes being committed because the police are too far away or too busy to deal with them right now.
Actually Florida is one of those states.
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Old 05-18-2012, 10:53 AM   #13
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Actually Florida is one of those states.
Florida's "stand your ground" law is getting a large amount of media attention right now... that's a pretty sharp example of "you don't have to wait for a cop in order to take action about a crime."
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Old 05-18-2012, 10:41 PM   #14
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Florida's "stand your ground" law is getting a large amount of media attention right now... that's a pretty sharp example of "you don't have to wait for a cop in order to take action about a crime."
Not being a smartass or anything, but I suggest some of those people tooting the horn try that, I guarantee some young punk will sue him after the fact and win. I do not agree with this, I am just stating what the court records show. Personally, I think if you have the balls to break the law you should be prepared for someone to react very badly.
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Old 05-19-2012, 12:57 AM   #15
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Not being a smartass or anything, but I suggest some of those people tooting the horn try that, I guarantee some young punk will sue him after the fact and win. I do not agree with this, I am just stating what the court records show. Personally, I think if you have the balls to break the law you should be prepared for someone to react very badly.
"I am just stating what the court records show."

I am sure you can back that up with some links to relevant verdicts or newspaper articles ...
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