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Old 12-29-2010, 10:28 PM   #1
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Question Is there a hack for displaying page numbers rather than location numbers?

Would anyone happen to know if there is a hack to override the location number system with a page number system? What I was envisioning was something that would estimate the number of pages that the open ebook would have with the current font size/type/spacing settings in place.

I suspect the simplest implementation would be something like:
(total number of characters in book) / (approximate # of characters on page) = number of pages in book

I've spent a while looking doing some Google searches, and couldn't turn anything up. Is there a hack specifically for this feature, or a larger hack that has this as a secondary feature?
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Old 12-29-2010, 10:35 PM   #2
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When I use to read books off my ipod, the Stanza app had this and I do miss it.

Also curious.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:49 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nesler View Post
I suspect the simplest implementation would be something like:
(total number of characters in book) / (approximate # of characters on page) = number of pages in book
Unfortunately that is not correct. The number of characters on a page is dependend of the size of those characters and als of the 'type' So if you change any of those two characteristics, the pagenumber would change.

In essence: When you are reading your book in the morning in bright daylight you can close our book on page 300 0f 1200, and when you start reading in the evening when the light is low, you select a character size one notch biger you are suddenly on page 350 of 1400

So there is no real page number in an eBook. It is something that is left over from pBooks.
The only number that is fixed is the actual number of characters that you have read. And that is exactly what the position is...well devided bij 128 it is.

Last edited by Ortep; 12-30-2010 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:50 PM   #4
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It seems that Duokan displays page numbers as default.

I just installed it today, and am unsure whether to keep it, but that is one nice feature.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:16 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ortep View Post
Unfortunately that is not correct. The number of characters on a page is dependend of the size of those characters and als of the 'type' So if you change any of those two characteristics, the pagenumber would change.

In essence: When you are reading your book in the morning in bright daylight you can close our book on page 300 0f 1200, and when you start reading in the evening when the light is low, you select a character size one notch biger you are suddenly on page 350 of 1400

So there is no real page number in an eBook. It is something that is left over from pBooks.
The only number that is fixed is the actual number of characters that you have read. And that is exactly what the position is...well devided bij 128 it is.
It seems to me that with a bit of forethought, an ebook could display what page you're on, regardless of font size. All that would be required is for the format to have some kind of XML tag for the pages (e.g., <page1>, </page1>), using the pages of the paper version as a guide.

For books that don't start off as paper, I don't think page numbers make sense.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhartman36 View Post

For books that don't start off as paper, I don't think page numbers make sense.
Maybe it'd help to think of location numbers as the location on a scroll.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silasgreenback View Post
Maybe it'd help to think of location numbers as the location on a scroll.
Right.

I can certainly see a desire and need for page numbers in e-books that also exist in print. There aren't any current citation guidelines that I know of that incorporate the idea of "location" in a book. Is there even a standard between ebook readers?

I don't know what the solution is, but I do think it's a problem for educational and research purposes.
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Old 12-30-2010, 05:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ortep View Post
Unfortunately that is not correct. The number of characters on a page is dependend of the size of those characters and als of the 'type' So if you change any of those two characteristics, the pagenumber would change.

In essence: When you are reading your book in the morning in bright daylight you can close our book on page 300 0f 1200, and when you start reading in the evening when the light is low, you select a character size one notch biger you are suddenly on page 350 of 1400

So there is no real page number in an eBook. It is something that is left over from pBooks.
The only number that is fixed is the actual number of characters that you have read. And that is exactly what the position is...well devided bij 128 it is.
I'm well aware of the fact that adjustments in font size or style (or line spacing) would change the pagination. If you look closely at my original post, that's exactly what I want. The only reason to have universal consistency is if you need to refer someone else with the same file to a given spot. I don't have that need.

Pagination in print books is arbitrary. Depending on how you set fonts and margins and line spacings, the same text can be 200 pages or 500 pages. It's just nice to have an easily recognizable measure of progress. Location numbers don't satisfy that desire.
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Old 12-30-2010, 05:41 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silasgreenback View Post
It seems that Duokan displays page numbers as default.

I just installed it today, and am unsure whether to keep it, but that is one nice feature.
Interesting. I've been eyeballing Duokan for a while. I've heard its handling of mobi files isn't as good as the native Kindle OS. Space, font, style issues, etc. What's your experience?
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:49 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nesler View Post
Interesting. I've been eyeballing Duokan for a while. I've heard its handling of mobi files isn't as good as the native Kindle OS. Space, font, style issues, etc. What's your experience?
There are some issues with Mobi files. A couple of the Project Gutenberg files I tried to open showed an error message and others loaded fine, so it seems pretty touch-and-go.

As far as Epub, everything went nicely.

Duokan has potential, but the translated version isn't quite translated all the way and without that, it just wasn't enough to keep installed.

UPDATE:

After uninstalling Duokan, I moved on to FBKindle and am much happier with that choice.

One huge advantage it has over Duokan is that there's no need to restart to switch to it as it runs in the background and can be activated by hot keys. Rolling a finger over alt, then shift, brings it right up. It also seems to be very highly customizable, with font and size tweaks for everything from book titles to the library tree.

You need to install Launchpad first, which confused me a little. You only need the lpad-pkg.tar.gz file to get it running, just put the matching bin file for your device on the root and install as usual. (The directory mnt/us means root, which I didn't know.)

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97636 (Launchpad link)

Then, just follow the instructions from this link and you're off and running:

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=107371

Should you decide to go that route, enjoy those Epubs!

Last edited by silasgreenback; 12-31-2010 at 12:58 AM.
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Old 12-31-2010, 06:01 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nesler View Post
The only reason to have universal consistency is if you need to refer someone else with the same file to a given spot. I don't have that need.
But why do you want page numbers when they are only an arbritary number with no meaning? Even if you are the only one reading the book you cannot find the position in your own book.

And if it is only used to see how far you are in a book any number is good enough. Percentage would be fine, but position also. And the last one has the advantage that it is more or less exact for everybody.

Quote:
Pagination in print books is arbitrary. Depending on how you set fonts and margins and line spacings, the same text can be 200 pages or 500 pages. It's just nice to have an easily recognizable measure of progress. Location numbers don't satisfy that desire.
If we have the same book, page 123 line 5 is exact the same text for us both. You cannot change the layout of a pBook on the fly after it is printed.

The only thing you can say for al books is Chapter 12, section 3, line 5.
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Old 01-01-2011, 02:36 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Ortep View Post
But why do you want page numbers when they are only an arbritary number with no meaning? Even if you are the only one reading the book you cannot find the position in your own book.
I kind of like knowing when I can get a chapter break, instead of just laying the book down on just any page, if I have to go do something.

I say this because on my old device it would say 113/148. meaning i had 35 pages until the next chapter.
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Old 01-01-2011, 02:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ortep View Post
But why do you want page numbers when they are only an arbritary number with no meaning? Even if you are the only one reading the book you cannot find the position in your own book.

My interest in something like this is mostly for book club/book review purposes.

The book club here has a page minimum, so, I would like to be able to stay within the guide lines. Although I can base the number of pages off of a printed version, not all ebooks have a printed counterpart. I also like to include the number of pages in my book reviews as a matter of courtesy.
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Old 02-07-2011, 05:33 PM   #14
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The new early preview software update 3.1 now includes the option to show page numbers it seems, this will only be possible with kindle books that have had page numbers inserted mind...
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Old 02-14-2011, 02:16 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ortep View Post
If we have the same book, page 123 line 5 is exact the same text for us both. You cannot change the layout of a pBook on the fly after it is printed.

The only thing you can say for al books is Chapter 12, section 3, line 5.
Even a slight increase/decrease of the font in an ePUB or Mobi/PRC can 1up entire lines throughout the book.

I kinda like the idea of first word --> last word = page XX of XXX. Maybe using simple <page1> ... </page1> tags as someone above suggested.
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