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Old 12-09-2010, 05:26 PM   #91
seajewel
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I may be wrong, but if you buy a book, you are able to then read it in multiple formats, I believe.. if that is true, then i am extremely happy. I own a Sony Reader and I love it to pieces, but I've been torn about moving to the Kindle for a while now. I like my epubs, and I've been trying to stay faithful to sony, but I feel like the Kindle is really starting to get ahead. I mostly read from my Sony at home, and occasionally in a pinch read off my iphone during lunch or at a waiting room, etc. outside of my home. This means that when I buy books off of booksonboard, typically where I get my epubs, I can't read them easily off of the iphone (i believe there is an app.. bluefire or something like that that can handle DRM'ed epubs, but i haven't tried it out). If I'm able to access a book I bought in different formats = win, since I won't have to agonize over whether I'll lose any books I bought if/when I move to the Kindle.

I am also definitely concerned about reports of errors. Nothing irks me more than buying an ebook and then finding it full of errors, or missing scene breaks, etc. It really totally ruins the reading experience. I *prefer* ebooks to paper books. It's more convenient and comfortable. But I don't want to sacrifice quality for that.. not to the extent that some poorly copied/formatted ebooks make me do after paying good money.

anyways just my quick thoughts. i may be completely off base, i only just heard about this and did a little bit of research on the site before posting here.

Last edited by seajewel; 12-09-2010 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 12-09-2010, 05:36 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
Google's fighting to not have to do opt-in. They don't want to have to contact every author & publisher of the thousands, maybe millions, of out-of-print works they've scanned.

Scanning is easy & quick (relatively) and can be done in bulk; finding & contacting copyright owners is slow and separate and requires tracking progress individually for each title. Removing books by request is easy; getting permission before starting is hard.

And I think there's no way they're going to get the agreement signed off in its current opt-out status. Or if they did, it'd immediately get bumped to a higher court, because it really does directly clash with the basic system of how copyright works.

All that work of scanning out-of-print works will be (mostly) wasted (it'll help with search abilities, but it won't make them real money)... and if they want to change that, they'll need to turn their attentions to changing copyright law. Which I'm much in favor of; I'd love Google to start pushing for a coherent & useful orphan works policy, and establish standards for what counts as a reasonable search for copyright owners. Google has the resources to make that possible; I'd love to see them work *with* the EFF to get us better copyright laws and enforcement policies.

I agree, especially since the current state of copyright law is the result of a corporation's fixing the legislative process.

Who has more clout these days, Google or Disney?
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Old 12-09-2010, 05:47 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khalleron View Post
I agree, especially since the current state of copyright law is the result of a corporation's fixing the legislative process.

Who has more clout these days, Google or Disney?
Disney has more political power but Google knows how the internet actually works. They're better equipped to argue for the future of technolegalities.

Copyright law reform needs an advocate like Google to go to Congress (or hell, the UN) and say, "look at all the shiny new toys and commerce and research and education and communication you *could* be having... if our hands weren't tied by this law that's not benefiting anybody but corporate lawyers." (I don't mean "copyright law;" I mean the aspects of it that deal with orphan works; I mean the lack of coherent rules about fair use; I mean the broken DCMA that doesn't allow for easy prosecution of false claims.)
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Old 12-09-2010, 06:30 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seajewel View Post
I may be wrong, but if you buy a book, you are able to then read it in multiple formats, I believe.. if that is true, then i am extremely happy. I own a Sony Reader and I love it to pieces, but I've been torn about moving to the Kindle for a while now.
I'm afraid the Kindle is not a device they currently support:

Quote:
"Amazon Kindle. Currently, Google eBooks are not compatible with Amazon Kindle devices, though we are open to supporting them in the future."
From http://books.google.com/support/bin/...&answer=179849

I believe you can read your book on the Kindle using the web browser, but only when you're connected via WiFi or 3G.

(Edit to add: the only other option, as far as I know, would be to download the EPUB version if available, strip the DRM, if it's present, then convert the EPUB to MOBI format and side load it onto your Kindle.)

Sorry...

Last edited by DMSmillie; 12-09-2010 at 06:33 PM.
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Old 12-09-2010, 06:59 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catlady View Post
The epub formatting seemed OK, it was the OCR that was horrible. I suppose I could have tried to run the .pdf version through Calibre and maybe gotten a better result. I'd have been willing to play around more if the price was less, but for $10, I didn't think I should have to fool with it.

It really soured me on Google's bookstore. I can't see buying from them again.
I bought the Harry Dresden short story collection titled "Side Jobs" from them
as an .acsm (ADE link to the .epub) which Google describes as an EPUB.
It turned out ok, but as it stands now I will only consider Google as a last
resort for a really hard to find ebook.

If any other distributor had products that demonstrated such poor quality
control, they would not survive very long. They will never be considered
the the "Newegg" of ebook retailing, not if they have results as reflected
in this thread.

Luck;
Ken
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Old 12-09-2010, 09:40 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Maltby View Post
I bought the Harry Dresden short story collection titled "Side Jobs" from them
as an .acsm (ADE link to the .epub) which Google describes as an EPUB.
It turned out ok, but as it stands now I will only consider Google as a last
resort for a really hard to find ebook.

If any other distributor had products that demonstrated such poor quality
control, they would not survive very long. They will never be considered
the the "Newegg" of ebook retailing, not if they have results as reflected
in this thread.
My purchase (William Irish/Cornell Woolrich's Phantom Lady) did not have DRM. Maybe the books that have DRM have gone through some better processing for epub conversion? The only sample that was available for my viewing was the pdf, not the epub. And of course I had no way of knowing if it had DRM or not.

It all just seems hit or miss. While Google was thankfully very prompt in issuing a refund, I imagine if I try again, get a messy file, and ask for another refund, they might well be less accommodating.

And I couldn't find books that interested me, anyway--no Marjorie Morningstar, no Forever Amber, no Shirley Jackson beyond the one volume every other store has.
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Old 12-09-2010, 11:02 PM   #97
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Every retailer needs to differentiate themselves from every other retailer offering the
same type of merchandise. They can be the store with the best selection, or the store
with the best quality, or the store with the lowest price, there has to be some thought
as what position in the marketplace the store is striving to take. It would be interesting
to see what they were/are aiming for with this eBookstore endeavor, perhaps it was
mentioned in the press release for the launch? What does Google think they are bringing
to the marketplace that would make it the customer's preferred place to buy ebooks?
There must have been something that was presented to the company's directors that
formed the basis for the approval to undertake this move.

Luck;
Ken
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Old 12-10-2010, 09:55 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
Google's fighting to not have to do opt-in. They don't want to have to contact every author & publisher of the thousands, maybe millions, of out-of-print works they've scanned.

[...]

...they'll need to turn their attentions to changing copyright law. Which I'm much in favor of; I'd love Google to start pushing for a coherent & useful orphan works policy, and establish standards for what counts as a reasonable search for copyright owners. Google has the resources to make that possible; I'd love to see them work *with* the EFF to get us better copyright laws and enforcement policies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
Copyright law reform needs an advocate like Google to go to Congress (or hell, the UN) and say, "look at all the shiny new toys and commerce and research and education and communication you *could* be having... if our hands weren't tied by this law that's not benefiting anybody but corporate lawyers." (I don't mean "copyright law;" I mean the aspects of it that deal with orphan works; I mean the lack of coherent rules about fair use; I mean the broken DCMA that doesn't allow for easy prosecution of false claims.)
I whole heartedly agree with Elfwreck. If anyone can get Congress to update the copyright laws it is Google.

My only fear is that it might be too late. If Google gets Congress to change laws allowing them (or anyone) to publish orphaned works then there will be screaming. The claim will be be that big evil Google is buying off Congress and getting Congress to give them the rights to millions of author's works. It won't matter if Congress is giving "everyone" access to orphaned works while insuring authors are still compensated. The narrative will be that Google is buying Congress and getting them to do what Google couldn't get done through the courts.
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Old 12-10-2010, 11:28 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
All that work of scanning out-of-print works will be (mostly) wasted (it'll help with search abilities, but it won't make them real money)... and if they want to change that, they'll need to turn their attentions to changing copyright law. Which I'm much in favor of; I'd love Google to start pushing for a coherent & useful orphan works policy, and establish standards for what counts as a reasonable search for copyright owners. Google has the resources to make that possible; I'd love to see them work *with* the EFF to get us better copyright laws and enforcement policies.
In our lifetime? With the current US political system? Like reforming the patent system? Like Mickey Mouse's copyright finally expired?

OK, this is the weekend, someone please come up with a lighter topic...
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Old 12-10-2010, 11:58 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Maltby View Post
What does Google think they are bringing
to the marketplace that would make it the customer's preferred place to buy ebooks?
There must have been something that was presented to the company's directors that
formed the basis for the approval to undertake this move.
Books that aren't available elsewhere, I would guess. It would be helpful if they'd let me browse just those exclusive books, instead of having to deal with all the usual suspects.
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Old 12-10-2010, 02:28 PM   #101
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I whole heartedly agree with Elfwreck. If anyone can get Congress to update the copyright laws it is Google.

My only fear is that it might be too late. If Google gets Congress to change laws allowing them (or anyone) to publish orphaned works then there will be screaming. The claim will be be that big evil Google is buying off Congress and getting Congress to give them the rights to millions of author's works. It won't matter if Congress is giving "everyone" access to orphaned works while insuring authors are still compensated. The narrative will be that Google is buying Congress and getting them to do what Google couldn't get done through the courts.

Yeah, well, the screaming hasn't bothered Disney.

If Google wants to take this on, I'd buy all my books from them, OCR errors and all.
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