View Full Version : iBooks: pictures do not show in tables


georg3200
09-22-2010, 05:57 AM
We have produced some epubs for our customers. Some of them contain short stories with a picture and a text of/about the author at the end.
The picture is at the left and right of it there is the text about the author.
We have put the picture and the text in a table, so that the text does not flow around the picture if you use a bigger font.

This works fine in ADE and on Sony-Readers, but on an iPad (in iBooks) the pictures in tables are not visible.
We tried older epubs with pictures in tables and we had only white space instead of pictures :(

Of course we can use something like blocks for that simple layout, but we have a lot of older epubs out there, where we can not change the layout.

Does someone has the same problem? Is there a solution? Or do we have to wait until Apple is conform with the standard?

Thanks

capidamonte
09-23-2010, 02:02 PM
Use CSS: the float:left setting, and proper margins, will work for what you're trying to do in iBooks.

As for waiting for Apple to support standards, remember that the purpose of any large corporation is first: profit, second: control, third: profit. How can they profit if they allow anyone to play? Playing fair doesn't fit the sociopathic mindset of these Masters-of-the-Universe types.

Yes, I just spent three days trying to get iBooks to break pages where I want and to show images in the background. It's retarded, and it's retarded on purpose. They've basically collapsed everything to inline, and table support is gacked.

There is no absolute positioning, there is no layering, there is no page-breaking (except on file-splits), and there is no font-choice. Basically, All Your Design Is Belong To Us.

F* Apple.

wannabee
11-05-2010, 12:46 AM
Has any found an easier work around yet?

shoshin
12-20-2010, 05:55 AM
Have the same problem as georg3200, but i can't use the suggested workaround!

I have to build ordered lists via tables. The reason for doing so is the fact that lists can be counted by 1., 2.,... or IV. or 1.a.3 or whatever you can image (paragraph nummeration in law sucks). So a table is necessary and cannot be replaced by an OL.
If I want to place an image in the text column the image doesn't show up in iBooks.

Any ideas how the problem can be solved?

Thanks a lot for any help!
And Hello to the board!

cheers, shoshin

wannabee
12-20-2010, 06:40 AM
See capidamonte's post #2. No pics in tables in the iBooks mate. you need to think outside the square.:D

wannabee
12-20-2010, 06:43 AM
One other thing crossed my mind. You could do a small table, one row even then a pic then another table.

shoshin
12-20-2010, 07:21 AM
hey wannabee,

thanks for the fast reply.
Same idea crossed my mind too. I don't like the idea of building small, fragmented tables only because Apple is not able to show image inside tables.
I don't see any problem to implement it.:angry:

edit: well, tested it with splitted tables. It works as expected, but still this kind of solution sucks.
Off-topic: why is there no reference implementation of epub out there which supports the complete ePub specification?!

Toxaris
12-20-2010, 02:03 PM
The problem is not a reference implementation of the specification, the problem is that Apple deliberately defies standard to keep control. There are, at least I heard, better programs for the iPad which follow the ePub specs better than iBooks.

JSWolf
12-31-2010, 11:07 AM
Bluefire Reader is one you should try for the iPad. It's uses ADE so if it works on your computer with ADE, it will work on the iPad with Bluefire Reader.

shoshin
04-21-2011, 05:20 AM
hey folks,

I still got the problem that images within tables don't show up under iBooks...

Maybe it would work with the Bluefire Reader, JSWolf mentioned, it's not the solution. I have to develop an ePUb based E-Book that works on ADE and iBooks as well...

Anyone out there, with the same problem? Any ideas or suggestions?

Edit: I finally found out what the problem was. iBooks cannot display images in tables when the image-element is nested in a div or paragraph element.

so:
.../td/img is working!
.../td/p/img is not working
.../td/div/img is not working

wannabee
04-23-2011, 05:10 AM
Thanks shoshin, I'll have to give that a try mate

JSWolf
04-23-2011, 06:18 PM
hey folks,

I still got the problem that images within tables don't show up under iBooks...

Maybe it would work with the Bluefire Reader, JSWolf mentioned, it's not the solution. I have to develop an ePUb based E-Book that works on ADE and iBooks as well...

Anyone out there, with the same problem? Any ideas or suggestions?

Edit: I finally found out what the problem was. iBooks cannot display images in tables when the image-element is nested in a div or paragraph element.

so:
.../td/img is working!
.../td/p/img is not working
.../td/div/img is not working

Give the Pigs, Gords, and Wikis (http://www.pigsgourdsandwikis.com/) blog a read. There is a lot of good information regarding iBooks. I do not recall if what you are looking for is mentioned there.

wannabee
04-24-2011, 05:43 AM
Give the Pigs, Gords, and Wikis (http://www.pigsgourdsandwikis.com/) blog a read. There is a lot of good information regarding iBooks. I do not recall if what you are looking for is mentioned there.
Wow. I'll follow up to see if she gets the info.

edit:
Hey Hey Hey! I now have finalised a book with images in the tables and now I can see them in iBooks. Thanks JSWolf.

JSWolf
05-04-2011, 12:11 PM
Wow. I'll follow up to see if she gets the info.

edit:
Hey Hey Hey! I now have finalised a book with images in the tables and now I can see them in iBooks. Thanks JSWolf.

Happy to help even though I'd like iBooks to die and go away.

pholy
05-05-2011, 07:16 PM
Happy to help even though I'd like iBooks to die and go away.

It doesn't really need to die, it just has to grow out of its childish non-conformity... :chinscratch:

JSWolf
05-05-2011, 07:37 PM
It doesn't really need to die, it just has to grow out of its childish non-conformity... :chinscratch:

That would mean then that iBooks was using ADE and given that Steve Jobs doesn't like Adobe, that will never happen. So yes, it has to die.

wannabee
05-08-2011, 07:00 AM
That would mean then that iBooks was using ADE and given that Steve Jobs doesn't like Adobe, that will never happen. So yes, it has to die.

:deadhorse:
Wishful thinking Mr Wolf.

wannabee
05-08-2011, 07:15 AM
It doesn't really need to die, it just has to grow out of its childish non-conformity... :chinscratch:
:offtopic: sort of

It's a little bit like when my computer had a mouse and a GUI, others in my firm couldn't see the need. Eventually it forced innovative catchup on behalf of everyone else. First the mouse and GUI, (windows) then networking, drawing, publishing They lead the way in the commercial main stream. This time Apple are dragging eBook die hards kicking and screaming into a new kind of eBook. Like a new computer OS, Macintosh, new phone, iPhone, new PDA, iPad wich iBooks is just an add on. There are scoffers and then there's the OMG we better catch up quick or get left behind.
These are my observations while using apple products since 1984. You don't have to like them. You don't have to use them. However, they are in your face and I don't think they are going away anytime soon.

DaleDe
05-16-2011, 12:16 PM
That would mean then that iBooks was using ADE and given that Steve Jobs doesn't like Adobe, that will never happen. So yes, it has to die.

Not so. ADE is also non-conforming. There is a specification and if Apple would follow it things would be much better. Here is a time where they could teach Adobe but unfortunately they have just gone a different path.

Dale

Adjust
05-16-2011, 06:37 PM
Edit: I finally found out what the problem was. iBooks cannot display images in tables when the image-element is nested in a div or paragraph element.

so:
.../td/img is working!
.../td/p/img is not working
.../td/div/img is not working

Brilliant...Mate thanks, this works a charm and looks awesome.
Very easy solution...much better then fluffing around with Floats

wannabee
05-16-2011, 07:19 PM
Brilliant...Mate thanks, this works a charm and looks awesome.
Very easy solution...much better then fluffing around with Floats

Marcus, Is that

heading
hr
table - 1 row, 2 col
text centred
table - 1 row, 2 col
text centred

or did you get the cols different widths in the one table?

Adjust
05-16-2011, 08:04 PM
Marcus, Is that

heading
hr
table - 1 row, 2 col
text centred
table - 1 row, 2 col
text centred

or did you get the cols different widths in the one table?

Heading is separate to the table.
<table><tr>
<td><img src="images/Future1.png" alt="future1" /></td>
<td valign="top" class="SubscribeText">There is a seemingly insatiable hunger for the stories of real people facing impossible odds, or dealing with the mundanity of life. will feature essays, memoir and fiction from leaders, artists, activists and explorers, as well as those who look deeply into the flux of domestic life and explore some of the underlying issues.
<p class="FutureTextSource"><b>Available August 2011</b></p></td></tr>
</table>
<table><tr>
<td valign="top" class="SubscribeText"> highly anticipated Third Annual Fiction Edition explores islands, both geographical and personal. This assortment of new fiction from the best emerging and established writers from Australia and the region promise a unique summer journey into localities of exclusivity, escape and enchantment.
<p class="FutureTextSource"><b>Available late October 2011</b></p></td>
<td><img src="images/Future2.png" alt="Future2" /></td></tr>
</table>

wannabee
05-16-2011, 08:06 PM
Thanks

Adjust
05-16-2011, 08:37 PM
No probs...

JSWolf
05-17-2011, 05:07 PM
Not so. ADE is also non-conforming. There is a specification and if Apple would follow it things would be much better. Here is a time where they could teach Adobe but unfortunately they have just gone a different path.

Dale

That may be so, but given that ADE is used in more ten any other ePub reading software, it's the one that all the others need to be compatible with. It would be a shame to spend time making an ePub that doesn't work well in ADE since most people reading it in ePub would be doing so using ADE.

wannabee
05-17-2011, 08:28 PM
That may be so, but given that ADE is used in more ten any other ePub reading software, it's the one that all the others need to be compatible with. It would be a shame to spend time making an ePub that doesn't work well in ADE since most people reading it in ePub would be doing so using ADE.

True. So I test mine in Bluefire as well as the iPad. I export from InDesign so I get to see them in ADE on screen the moment they export. Not very pretty actually. Until you start the editing. It would be nice to have a kindle as well but I have to settle for the mobipocket reader.

I guess what I'm waffling about is that it needs to look good on everything so if the actually look fantastic in iBooks . . . all the better.

Adjust
05-18-2011, 03:05 AM
I use the kindle desktop previewer to check mine, after converting to .mobi.

But yes, regardless of whether ADE is in more devices. I code for iPad, if it works there then I'm pretty safe it's going to work in ADE.

JSWolf
05-18-2011, 10:21 AM
I use the kindle desktop previewer to check mine, after converting to .mobi.

But yes, regardless of whether ADE is in more devices. I code for iPad, if it works there then I'm pretty safe it's going to work in ADE.

Not always. Some of the workarounds for iBooks may not be compatible of even work the same. So you might have to have two different versions. One for iBooks and one for ADE.

Adjust
05-18-2011, 11:06 PM
Not always. Some of the workarounds for iBooks may not be compatible of even work the same. So you might have to have two different versions. One for iBooks and one for ADE.

Yes, but that comes out in the QA Testing preview part. Unlike the other way round, For example the sans serif debacle in iBook.

Sans-serif that looks good in ADE, drops out in iBooks.
But if I code for iBooks I know 100% that the sans-serif WILL display in ADE.

Dammed if you, do dammed if you don't.

wannabee
05-19-2011, 12:29 AM
Yes, but that comes out in the QA Testing preview part.

Would you mind letting me know your QA process and if testing for iBooks how do you isolate your files to stop iTunes from adding the playlist?

Adjust
05-19-2011, 03:13 AM
Would you mind letting me know your QA process and if testing for iBooks how do you isolate your files to stop iTunes from adding the playlist?

I don't. Why would I need to?

I do a very quick check in ADE (because nothing looks as it should in this for some reason) make adjustments fix errors until ok in epubcheck

I load up the book to iPad iBooks. Run through everything checking all hyperlinks are working, all images are in place and are at the correct size, all fonts are as they should be (sans-serif) bullet/number lists etc etc.

If ok I then convert to .mobi from .epub (still on my desktop) the open the kindle desktop viewer to make sure everything is in place (I don't do a complex check, just a quick run through, because if it works in iBook then it'll work in kindle...hyperlinks etc)

wannabee
05-20-2011, 02:48 AM
I don't. Why would I need to?
If you test the file on an iPad, iTunes adds the playlist metadata file. However, Ive read that the metadata invalidates the file when uploading to iBookstore which leaves you having to open the package, remove the playlist and rezip it again. :furious:

Adjust
05-20-2011, 03:05 AM
If you test the file on an iPad, iTunes adds the playlist metadata file. However, Ive read that the metadata invalidates the file when uploading to iBookstore which leaves you having to open the package, remove the playlist and rezip it again. :furious:

Arh...well. I haven't been able to work out how to get the epub out of itunes once I put it there so I always use a secondary file :p