Those of you who have the Reader already, could you comment on battery lifetime?

A Li-ion has to go the first couple of times through a complete charge decharge cycle before it will obtain his full capacity. Typically it's like 3 to 4 cycles. I think it's good if the people that have their Reader to not vote after the first cycle because otherwise we get a wrong image.

we could be waiting months for the result.

Maybe not, all we have to do is have folks make it to the 20+ mark, and then they can cast an honest, informed vote. :tongue3:

Maybe not, all we have to do is have folks make it to the 20+ mark, and then they can cast an honest, informed vote. :tongue3:


Another "problem", the reader is also charged by plugging it into the USB port on a computer. I've been plugging it in, downloading various books I've converted to RTF, adjusting fonts, etc. So... unless someone downloads all the books they want to read for a month and never connects their reader to their computer in that time, we may never know!

Reminds me of the tootsie pop commercials. How many licks to get to the center of a tootsie pop. The world may never know... :shy:

Same point here, I'll prob be plugging it in at least once a week for an update so I don't see it ever really running down.

Same point here, I'll prob be plugging it in at least once a week for an update so I don't see it ever really running down.And wouldn't that be just awful to live with? :grin:

It's not supposed to charge very fast from the USB (6 hrs compared to 4 on the wall) so I don't know how much charging it'd get from just managing content. Maybe we'll never know how many licks it takes, but I think I could live with that. :grin2:

Okay you lot who've had your readers a few days -- Hasn't anyone passed the 20 hour use mark yet? :grin2:

Of course, the fact that no-one's voted yet may mean it's lasting more 8 hours or so .... :tongue3:

Not yet, with all the possible file formats to try, I keep connecting via USB, and Reader keeps recharging :)

If anything is going to break, it probably will be USB port :)

Aw, c'mon folks use the SD card to load your files! :laugh4:

Okay you lot who've had your readers a few days -- Hasn't anyone passed the 20 hour use mark yet?

Well I got it Sun morning so I passed that mark sometime early Monday. :)

Well I got it Sun morning so I passed that mark sometime early Monday. :)... and how's the battery doing?

Well I got it Sun morning so I passed that mark sometime early Monday. :)You gonna vote then? :grin:

we could be waiting months for the result.I like the new avatar, ultim8fury. :smile:

Thanks, I use it on all the forums I frequent and various projects I play around with.

I'm not clear on what we're asking for here...are you trying to find out how many hours the battery lasts during actual, solid reading time? Or just how long it lasts overall from one charge to the next, idle time and reading time combined? I mean, I have no idea how many hours I've actually spent reading on it...I don't really track that. I can say I've done at least some reading on it every day since I got it on 10/1/2006, probably only averaging about 45 min a day, and the battery still shows as being fully charged.

We're trying to get an idea of how much "on" time it gives us, I think. So basically time spent actually reading, and any spent lying around on, but not being actively used would qualify. That's what I'm building my estimate on, anyway. Most of it will end up being actual read time, I think.

I hope to be able to vote Monday or so, now that the weekend is coming and I'll have a bit more reading time. :beam:

I cannot explain it, but here it is
1) Yesterday noon, I noticed that battery indicator shows 3/4 of charge
2) Yesterday evening and today morning it shows full charge
3) I have not charged the reader

If I were Sony, I would add some "piezo charger" under page turns button. So while happy user is flipping pages - Reader gets charged :)

To Sony: Umm, if you decided to do that, don't forget who came up with the idea, ok? I don't need much, just every new gadget you release ... for free of cause :)

I cannot explain it, but here it is
1) Yesterday noon, I noticed that battery indicator shows 3/4 of charge
2) Yesterday evening and today morning it shows full charge
3) I have not charged the readerAt a guess you're floating around the 75% mark, and with only 4 blocks of resolution on the battery meter, turning the Reader off for a while gives it enought "rest" to convince it that it's above the 3rd block. It'll probably flutter around a while before it decides that you're really down to only 3 blocks. All my guessing, mind you. :smile:

I've seen that a lot with all kinds of batteries... they seem to "recharge" themselves slightly when off for a while. But it doesn't usually last too long.

Remember the battery indicator is probably just a volt meter for the battery power level which drops voltage gradually as the charge fades until it's not enough to power the device. Not sure, but isn't that how it works? So after being off, the battery can, for some reason, be "rested" and supply a little extra juice for a bit.

That's essentially correct, as I understand it, Bob, but I'm a ways from my training in that area. :( I seem to recall that effect called a "surface charge" -- it can make a completely dead car battery read 12 VDC to a voltmeter. It has the voltage, but no current to back it up for any appreciable time. At a guess (my training didn't even include the theory behind this in the first place), it's a matter of electrons collecting at the (negative) contact point and showing an increased potential. Perhaps there's an actual practicing EE out there who can expand on the bits this thoroughly non-practicing, former EET mis-remembers. :grin:

It looks like noone has run down the battery of his or her Reader yet, coz I see no votes ;)

This thread looks good. Seems, that in normal use there is no significant battery discharge. This is just the way it should be! There is probably no real point to have exact hours battery life.

Yep, this is great.

Now, teach the iRex Guys how to do this...:-)

Perhaps the poll should be changed to how long it takes to run down a single bar :)

Perhaps the poll should be changed to how long it takes to run down a single bar :)Not a bad idea :smile:

As the first (to my mild surprise) voter, let me say that I'm now well past the 20 hour mark, both with fairly heavy reading use, and deliberately leaving it on when I lay the Reader down and leave it, so that it turns itself off after 60 minutes. I have had it connected to the USB for about 20 minutes (cumulative time), or about 1/18th of the nominal USB charging time, and I've waited several extra hours to vote. (If 20 minutes is enough to keep it this charged for that kind of usage, I call it a big "win")

The battery meter's reading after all that? 4 blocks. Yup, still reading fully charged. :grin:

Or may be we should count page turns? Otherwise it would be very hard to get battery time in hours. Unless Nathan can devote himself completely just for reading untill battery dies :)

Unless Nathan can devote himself completely just for reading untill battery dies :)Sadly, I cannot. :sad:

Well, apparently Sony has done a good job this time...

I really eny you guys. I like my Iliad, but the fact that I always have to tug a charger around and can actually watch the battery-meter move downwards sometimes is just plain annoying. I hope iRex will put a bit of effort into getting this working...-(

Wow - battery life does seem nothing short of phenomenal. Originally was thinking of re-charging once a week. Now, maybe once a month? Being on the West coast, if the "big one" hits, this is one device I want with me!

Maybe this is the same great performance Sony laptop batteries exhibited...right before they went nuclear! :laugh:

Unless Nathan can devote himself completely just for reading untill battery dies :)Sadly, I cannot. :sad:I did calculate that 7,800 consecutive page turns, at 1 second each, would take 2 hours & 10 minutes. :mad:

So, let's see, the iLiad's 10,000 page turns would take ... um, 2 hours, 46 minutes and 40 seconds. :jester:

I did calculate that 7,800 consecutive page turns, at 1 second each, would take 2 hours & 10 minutes. :mad:

I'm sure you can spare 2 hours for this test :D

But, that will work only with TXT, BBEB, and RTF books (or FAST formats) :)
With PDF books, page turns take 2-8 seconds (obviously SLOW format).

BTW, I think that battery life depends on what you are reading - FAST or SLOW formats.

I'm sure you can spare 2 hours for this test :DYes, but the 10 minutes are another thing. :tongue3:

I think you're right about the format making a difference, clearly processing time has to have an effect on power consumption.

Then there's the whole question of finding a 7,800 page document....

Not to mention finding a physical therapist for the carpal tunnel problems you'll have after pressing the next page button that many times in a row....

Yes, but the 10 minutes are another thing. :tongue3:

That's unfortunate, but me thinks we can settle with 2 hours and 7200 click-o-pages or page-o-clicks :)

Then there's the whole question of finding a 7,800 page document....

Book with 7800 pages? Easy - "War and Peace" :) If it's not enough, one can copy/paste until all pages are there.

On other hand it wont be representative, 10 books with 720-780 pages each or same book but read 10 times are closer to real-life conditions :)

I could use all ten fingers ... and my nose ... that should do for the first 3,750 pages or so ... then ... maybe toes? Elbows? Hmmm. :mad:

After a full week of usage, still 4 blocks for me. :beam:

Same here (well almost a week), and my Reader certainly has hasn't been sitting idle!
It's the first time I've ever had something run this long without sucking the battery down. But then it's not really running most of the time of course... Weird though to still see the bars not changing...

roughly 2000 page turns so far on the initial shipping charge and it just dropped to 2 bars.

After a full week of usage, still 4 blocks for me. :beam:

You have to actually read the books, not just look at the Reader :shrug:

You have to actually read the books, not just look at the Reader :shrug:Read? All my books have pretty pictures! :laugh4:

Wow, mine finally dropped one bar today

It'll probably go back up if you turn it off for a few minutes. They seem to flutter around the transitions for a while before settling into the lower reading. :smile:

I don't know that I"ll ever run the battery down realistically. Unless I load up 200 books and just do a "how many weeks of fairly constant reading can I get out of the Reader" test. I seem to plug it in every two or three days to bring down another collection, and it keeps topping that battery back off.

Well done on the battery life, Sony!

I seem to plug it in every two or three days to bring down another collection, and it keeps topping that battery back off. I've been doing my best to avoid plugging it in, probably no more than 40 minutes all together. If all it takes to keep the battery topped off is transferring books onto it periodically, then ... well, I'd call that a success, anyway. :thumbsup:

Hi guys! back for a day!

Since the reader is so efficient with power why don't they put a solar cell like on a calculator?

Welcome back, yvanleterrible! I was just thinking about you earlier, today! Now that you're here, maybe you'll consider shortening your hiatus? You've already got a lot to catch up on. :beam:

I'm not sure where they'd put a solar cell, there's not much wasted space -- I suppose we could clip it to the cover. :smile:

I'm not sure where they'd put a solar cell, there's not much wasted space -- I suppose we could clip it to the cover. :smile:

Nope, not there :) Sigh, I'm late again, wanted to come up with mock-ups for the same idea and search-by-joystick thing. I guess, I cannot claim every great idea as my own :)

Don't get greedy, Slava. :grin2:

Happy day to see you here Yvan!

I like the solar charger idea too. But since the Reader rarely needs recharging, maybe it wouldn't get used very much or be needed by many people anyway. Personally, I top it off when I dock it.

But for those who want one, I'm pretty sure there are portable electronics solar chargers out there already that would work great. It just wouldn't be integrated.

But for those who want one, I'm pretty sure there are portable electronics solar chargers out there already that would work great. It just wouldn't be integrated.

It would work really well if it attached to the usb port at the bottom and was as wide as the reader itself, then it would be semi-integrated

Ok, here is the second version. First one had solar panel on the top, but I didn't like it. Also, Sony can add piezo-charges under button. After all whole thing based on clicking :)

having it on the open side of the cover to act as a counterweight to the reader would be nice. It would make it easier to hold with just one hand and give a large surface area.

Hi guys! back for a day!

Since the reader is so efficient with power why don't they put a solar cell like on a calculator?

A solar cell would be a nice complement specially since you need light to read e-ink. When's the last time you had to recharge your calculator ?You'd never need to recharge your reader.

I suppose if you could find a commercial unit with the right voltage output....

Any calculator with a decent sized screen (think graphing calculators) need to be recharged/new batteries fairly often. I would dare say more often than the Reader.

After two full weeks of usage, still two blocks!

I'm still showing full blocks after a couple of weeks and about 2,400ish pages. I have plugged it into the computer a couple of times for transfers maybe about 30 minutes total. It seems even with daily use I'm only going to need to charge this thing 5-6 times a year. That is awesome.

Yeah. I'm finding that my battery indicates full charge (all blocks filled in on the meter).
I don't specifically try to charge it. I only have it on the cradle to transfer books. What a wonderful feeling of freedom to not have to worry about the battery.

I hope Sony doesn't consider it overkill and cut back if there is ever a next generation of devices. This is a real big positive for the product.

Okay, 16 days of use with minimal charging, and it reads 1 block.


Mindfull of the earlier discussion about not deep-discharging LiOn batteries I decided to go on and recharge it -- it only took 2 hours to fully charge rather than the stated 4, anyone else see anything like that?

I'd not have been surprised by around 3, since it was 3/4 discharged, but 2?

Well last night I hit about 3,000 pages and it finally dropped a bar, so I'm at 3/4ths. Only charging has been plugging it into USB to transfer books.

All charging times vary Natch, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Wasn't worried, LG, more in the area of "pleased." :smile:

Hi everybody!
I've had my Reader for a week now. Battery seems to go on forever whilst reading but runs down much quicker using the MP3 player, which BTW is really good. I keep a separate memory stick just for the music so as not to clog up the onboard memory. So far I'm really impressed.
(If you want to run down the battery for recharging purposes just leave the MP3 running)

Say, for the two folks out there who only got 10 hours out of their Readers, what were the conditions?

....I keep a separate memory stick just for the music so as not to clog up the onboard memory....
Memory sticks! A true Sony user you are. :wink:

Yep. Guilty as charged :( (but I don't own shares - honest)

I don't have a problem with SD cards either!

(actually I just remembered - I'm using an mini SD card with an adapter)

Does... Not unpacking the power supply yet mean anything.... Sheech it would wear out the Energizer Bunny!

Would expect audio to decrease the run time...

Here is one way to manage your battries.. Was posted on the Cowon A2 forum a few months back..

http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm

I've had my second Reader (first one, screen died, took it back to the SonyStyle store, and they handed me a new one, no fuss - yay), for a little more than a week, and I've only lost one battery bar. I've read more than 4000 page turns worth as well. I had the first one for 2 weeks (working), and I couldn't drain the battery til I left it in the car in ~ 50 degree weather for several hours. I love this thing!!!! I'd say you could get away with charging it about once every month and a half if you were going for maximum battery life usage between charges.

Oh, and I'm still running Win2K, so I haven't plugged the reader into a usb port yet - all SD transfers, so no little extra charging here and there, for those who wondered about that earlier.

I must have the record.. I got the battery down to 1 bar on the the first day of usage...

Took it straight from the charger in the morning to work and used it the whole time as a music player. It was down to one bar by the time I got home that night.

It works fine as a basic music player by the way.. I had some nice classical music and enya on there. Just relaxing stuff that I could listen to while I read.

Today I made a point to use it throughout the day, but not as a music player. It's stayed at 4 bars. I've read maybe 100 pages. I just love this thing.

I think it will be difficult to measure hours of usage. For me, the time is cumulative, and very difficult to track. For another thing, reading speed varies widely and since most power is consumed during page changes, battery "time" will vary accordingly.

However, I've read ~800 pages and just dropped to 3/4 bars. I've never used a memory stick or played music. I have moved through a lot of menus and sample pages for co-workers, figure maybe another 100 turns or so.

So, if I assume ~900 pages at 3/4 of a charge that only gets to 3600 pages, about half of Sony's claim of 7-7.5k page turns.

*However*, as it has been pointed out, a Li-ion battery doesn't hit full charge after the first cycle. In fact, I'm not sure it was plugged in long enough to get to a completely full charge before I started playing (couldn't resist). So don't jump to conclusions yet.

So, I'm going to make an effort not to sync or charge until I've run it down to a single bar, and should be able to give another estimate then...

...but what is the battery life like while playing audio? has anyone tested that?
-m

I've had my Reader for 11 days now and have been doing a lot of reading. I haven't charged it once yet and the battery level still shows full :D

Okay my battery has gone down a notch, I have had it alittle over a week. About 576 pages read while playing with it and having to back up because I hit those stupid little buttons on the bottom and go way out there and lose my place. Also I put a song in this thing and listened to it twice (not bad sounding either if I do say so myself)....

I was asking about if we should charge it before it dies, someone said let it discharge, so I am assuming let it go completely to almost dead before charging it again.

Ah the life of a battery.

Yes the music sounds good but listening and reading are two things I cannot do at the same time. I get distracted enough and wouldn't know what the heck I was reading. Bad enough at home and the little distractions that happen that just mess up my brain, LOL.

You can recharge anytime.

You can recharge anytime.

Thanks. That is how I pretty much took it with that last link someone posted.

over 20 hours easily so far and have not even lost a bar on the batt meter yet :-) I figure I should get at least 6 months to 8 months on a charge and most of that will be standard battery self discharge.

I might run it dead a few times a couple times a year by playing mp3's JUST to exercise the battery a bit (since that too can kill it) or with some audible books (I convert all of them to mp3 anyway so it should work fine though not sure if I can bookmark an mp3 in the reader ? guess I will have to try it and see what happens.

I really wish they had stuck with AAA's 3 AAA cells could have fit inside there without making it ANY bigger. real pitty.

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

I am a person that would prefer the battery as they have it. I don't want to be messing with AAA's all the time, but then that is my preference. Same with my digital camera, like the rechargers and not carrying around batteries.

... not sure if I can bookmark an mp3 in the reader?Not bookmarks, as such, but when you 'stop' the player, it really pauses, so it holds your place automatically, which is pretty much the same thing. :nice:

well actually that does not work either. if you turn it off and or remove the SD card (probably the latter) it loses this information :-( Alas this makes it completely useless for audio books :-( damn I was looking forward to that dual functionality. Hopefully we can convince them to add this.

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

also AAA's would be better in this application. Think remote control? would you use rechargeable's in remote ? no they run so long its annoying. in this the AAA's would run EVEN LONGER than the lithium battery pack. You would have to change the batteries MAYBE once a year if that. and for this benifit you NEVER have to worry about a "non easily removable" impossible possibly to replace battery pack dying on you rendering your otherwise perfectly good gadget useless.

In something like a PDA where you have to charge it sometimes DAILY or a cell phone FINE but in something like this rechargeable is counter productive. It runs sooo darned long that it silly not to use simply long lasting alkalines.

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

In something like a PDA where you have to charge it sometimes DAILY or a cell phone FINE but in something like this rechargeable is counter productive. It runs sooo darned long that it silly not to use simply long lasting alkalines.

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

Don't forget that people who use the Reader as an MP3 player probably are re-charging daily - or close to daily. AAA's probably wouldn't work well in that scenario.

I once had a phone that played mp3s and it would last until noon before it needed a recharge. After a week I removed the mp3s. I returned then phone within the first month.

My vote is for 3 x AAA batteries. When travelling most trips don't last more than 2 months so you don't need a charger unless listening to music. Of course, MP3 players these days are so cheap and small, why would I bother with the bulky reader???? In the worst case you can always purchase Alkaline AAA just about anywhere in the world.

Ideally, you will use 3 AAA NiMH (rechargable) batteries. You can still plugin the reader to recharge as now. You can even use the newer low self-discharge types such as Eneloop which can sit unused for months and still retain most of the charge. The key difference here is that if/when they become old and you need to replace them it is trivial. If/when you don't have any charging options available you can always grab regular cheap AAAs as a temporary replacement.

As it is now there are few options. You need to open it, which is easy but not every day type thing - takes half an hour as it must be done with care. Then you need to locate a new replacement battery. That can be difficult as it is not a standard format, hence few suppliers will offer them. Concordantly they will demand a higher premium, markup. Here is an example of a very similar battery for my PDA:

http://www.tangshop.com/palm-zire-71-battery.html

Price: $24.95

By the time I pay for shipping and other fees, it will be minimum $30. I could probably purchase 3 Eneloop NiMH AAAs for at most $10 at a local store. They will last just as long if not longer. They'll offer a similar performance. etc.

Having a "non replacable" battery certainly doesn't seem to have done the iPod any harm. Why mess with the design for the sake of something that's probably a complete "non issue" for the overwhelming majority of users?

Having a "non replacable" battery certainly doesn't seem to have done the iPod any harm. Why mess with the design for the sake of something that's probably a complete "non issue" for the overwhelming majority of users?
Actually it is an issue for most working class people. Have you tried sending your iPod back for repowering? You're left without the use of your device for a fairly long time and with the added costs of mailing it is quite an expensive proposition; almost half of the original lower model's price. What I hate most is that when I deprive my family of part of the communal income for my extravaganza, I expect the device to at least last.

Some people will just dump their gadget on their less fortunate friends. Here we call that a poisonous gift because they are the ones caught with the after expenses.

That brings me to an other partly related thought. Who buys old used cars?...poorer people. When gas becomes really expensive, only rich people will be able to afford those hybrid cars. Then, who'll be stuck with the old guzzling SUVs?

Harry,
I think you neglect significant differences between iPod/music and Reader/books. For starters, the physical format of iPods is much smaller, making more compact LiIons an obvious choice. iPods are designed to be carried around, in a pocket, etc. Chances are higher that you'll drop iPod (as I drop my MP3 player once in a while) compared to the Reader which is clearly not designed to be carried any place. Readers will generally going to receive a much better care than iPods. Hence iPod lifespan is going to be limited to not much beyond battery lifespan. Moreover changing styles, preferences, etc. will also prompt iPods users who often care about styling and such to change sooner rather than later.

Reader meanwhile has nothing to do with styling. It is just a plain black tablet. It will be abused less and has few moving parts, so should be able to last much longer. As it performs a rather mundane task of displaying text, there is much less room for improvement. We want have the next reader displaying videos of whatever, and adding bling, etc. It will display the latest books in 10 years just as well.

The other difference is the content. Music preferences change often and so do player preferences. With books it is the opposite. Once you go through the trouble of copying a bunch of content into a Reader, then changing to a newer model is a hassle you'd rather avoid. Books are longer lasting and people sometimes wish to return to a book, maybe read it again, etc.

Reader meanwhile has nothing to do with styling. It is just a plain black tablet. It will be abused less and has few moving parts, so should be able to last much longer. As it performs a rather mundane task of displaying text, there is much less room for improvement. We want have the next reader displaying videos of whatever, and adding bling, etc. It will display the latest books in 10 years just as well.


I take your point about the fickleness of style, Bob, but I think that there's huge room for improvement in the Reader, and that it will be regarded as "outdated" just as quickly as any iPod when newer devices with colour screens, higher resolution, etc, come along in a year or so. I don't personally believe that the supposedly "finite" life of a LiIon battery in the Reader is any more important than it is on the iPod.

I may very well be wrong - time will tell!

Consider, though - when was the last time that you say any new electronic device that used AA or AAA batteries? They all seem to use LiIon batteries now, and I don't think that's a trend that's going to be reversed.

I take your point about the fickleness of style, Bob, but I think that there's huge room for improvement in the Reader, and that it will be regarded as "outdated" just as quickly as any iPod when newer devices with colour screens, higher resolution, etc, come along in a year or so. I don't personally believe that the supposedly "finite" life of a LiIon battery in the Reader is any more important than it is on the iPod.

I may very well be wrong - time will tell!

Consider, though - when was the last time that you say any new electronic device that used AA or AAA batteries? They all seem to use LiIon batteries now, and I don't think that's a trend that's going to be reversed.
Right about that Harry! Big outfits rarely take out a product without an aftermarket thought. And you can also bet that each battery is different. Can you say Babelbattery? :happy2:

Can you say Babelbattery?No, I can't -- you should wash your mouth out with soap for saying such a foul word! http://www.sims99.com/forum/images/smilies/nova_censored.gif

well WHY don't you see them using AAA AA ? (consider the FIRST sony ebook librie used AAA's) the reason for this is battery life. Most portable devices are HIGH DRAIN or "often drained" ie you use it a LOT

With something like this (VERY LOW DRAIN) regardless of usage pattern it makes NO SENSE to use a rechargeable battery.

I am the kind of person who keeps my gadgets for a LONG TIME. I still have (and use every now and then) my original palm pilot :-) it has its uses :-)

I don't like it when my gadgets become paper weights JUST because of a damned battery. Now if its something so specialized that its required to make it useful FINE (note a replaceable battery is NO better than a NON Replaceable battery since the same problem exists. will you be able to FIND any battery replaceable or not.

IF its something that will be replaced with something newer anyway (mini mp3 players) I can tolerate it.

but for something like this reader which I plan on using for 10+ years (the battery WILL NOT last that long mind you) it bugs the crap out of me (though not enough not to buy it)

AAA's will be here long after you and I are dead :-)

If they wanted to include batteries make them NIMHS and alkalines would probably last for over 10,000 page turns!

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

well WHY don't you see them using AAA AA ? (consider the FIRST sony ebook librie used AAA's) the reason for this is battery life. Most portable devices are HIGH DRAIN or "often drained" ie you use it a LOT

With something like this (VERY LOW DRAIN) regardless of usage pattern it makes NO SENSE to use a rechargeable battery.


Because, as I said in an earlier post, Chris, it is "high drain" if you use it as an MP3 player. Not that I would do personally, because my iPod is a much better MP3 player, but remember that the Reader is an MP3 player as well as a book reader.

I don't think many people would want to have to buy a new set of AAA batteries every day, if they were to use it for that purpose. Plugging it into a wall socket for a couple of hours is much less hassle.

Because, as I said in an earlier post, Chris, it is "high drain" if you use it as an MP3 player. Not that I would do personally, because my iPod is a much better MP3 player, but remember that the Reader is an MP3 player as well as a book reader.

I don't think many people would want to have to buy a new set of AAA batteries every day, if they were to use it for that purpose. Plugging it into a wall socket for a couple of hours is much less hassle.

I know I sure wouldn't want to go out and buy batteries all the time. My camera which is an old sony mavica (which has finally been replaced with a 10 mexapixel which sony didn't have even one, LOL) it's battery is rechargeable and still on the go and I have had it for a long long time, I can probably even say close to ten years, or so it would seem......and if the time comes this reader needs a new one, I will take it to the sony store and let them put a new one in it for me. I sure as heck am not going to tear the thing apart, ha ha. A vacuum cleaner I do , but this reader......... nope.

Mi MHs are the best because of all the types of available power cells they are the less toxic for environment. Is choose most electronic equipment according to two features. SD compatibility and double or triple A power. With intelligent charger, batteries take from 1 to 2 hours to charge. My older cells are 8 years old and still take a long drain time.

Does anyone know if there is an other standard coming along that would be even less toxic? I would also like to see an even smaller rechargeable size than 3A.

Does anyone know if there is an other standard coming along that would be even less toxic? I would also like to see an even smaller rechargeable size than 3A.

Several companies are working on fuel cells to power notebook PCs, but I don't know if they could be made small enough for something like the Reader. Fuel cells are very environmentally friendly - their only by-product is water vapour.

The main problem with them is hydrogen containment; there is a 10% loss per day of the gas permeating through the barrier in the best materials.

Also companies promoting hydrogen(all petrol companies) want us to be dependant on them. The same reason no one wants electric cars. They want consumers keeping the petrol fuel(s) distribution networks in place, intact and lucrative.

Does anyone know if there is an other standard coming along that would be even less toxic? I would also like to see an even smaller rechargeable size than 3A.These things (http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7677) (still very experimental) have me positively drooling.

If they pan out they potentially could even make electric cars actually practical -- no having to wait 10 hours for your car to re-charge so you can continue your trip. :grin:

The main problem with them is hydrogen containment; there is a 10% loss per day of the gas permeating through the barrier in the best materials.

I believe that the way that's being overcome is to store the fuel in an external tank, and only feed it to the cell as required. The demos I've seen of the notebook batteries have a separate fuel tank and a tiny mechanical pump which feeds the fuel (ethanol) into the cell as it's required.

Obviously, though, notebook batteries can be enormously larger than a Reader's battery. It'll probably be a long time before such things can be reduced in size sufficiently for something the size of the Reader.

I thought fuel cells only used hydrogen, there's an ethanol one?

Yes, the demo I saw of a notebook battery was fuelled by ethanol. You just squirted ethanol from a little squeezy bottle into a valve on the side of the battery and it powered it for about 12h. Very neat!

Very neat indeed. I'd like to see that, myself. :grin:

I found a couple of interesting links (amazing what you can find with google if you just look :)) here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct-ethanol_fuel_cell) and here (http://running_on_alcohol.tripod.com/id30.html).

When I opened my Sony Reader on Dec. 24 (early xmas present :), I charged it fully, loaded some books, and then began playing with it unpluged. I have probably done about 1000 "page turns." I am estimating the number of "page turns" by including:
1. Actual page turns in a book
2. Approximate number of times turn on and off (each counting "1 page turn")
3. Approximate number of times I've switched the page to view the menu or to set a bookmark.

I have not charged it since Dec. 24 and just today, I got the "low battery" warning. This seems short of the 7000+ sony stated. I assume this is because the battery drains over time and that it takes a few charges to reach peak power storage. I would also assume it uses some power to remember which book you are reading since it turns on with the last page viewed. I should also note that I use an SD card, which may use up more power to access?

With the extreme cold we are currently experiencing here in Denver, CO. I just experienced an incredible drop from fully charged to three bars--in one day. Most of my reading was done outside, in the cold, while smoking. In addition to todays low temps, we've had a few days in the sub 40's since I've purchased my Reader (28th Dec), and had recharged it last night at two bars (only because I was updating books and figured I'd just let it charge until the light went out).

The times I noticed sudden changes in the battery meter seemed to be during the cold as well. Several times I went from three bars during the (cold) day, back to four at night when reading in (warm) bed.

I have an MP3 player that uses a single AAA battery. I use NiMH AAA battery and it lasts a long time, many hours. You could easily design the Reader to use 3 or 4 AAAs and still be able to play music for a long time while turning pages. Self discharge is higher in typical NiMH, while LiIon is much lower, hence the choice of LiIon. However, he new Eneloop and hybrid type NiMH batteries also have a very low self discharge rate. That provides the best of both:
1) can be left alone for months and batteries won't drain
2) can provide a lot of current for MP3 playing and other needs
3) still has plenty of juice for music and page turns
4) can recharge

L1Wulf,
Batteries produce electricity via chemical processes which invariably slow down a great deal at low temps, such as 0 C and below freezing. The meter is simply telling you that the battery is unable to produce the necessary current and is not actually empty. After it warms up the meter will bounce back up.

Thus you really cannot use the reader outside during winter and there is no easy solution :(

My last post was done during single digit weather (Fahrenheit, I should point out) and the night after posting, the battery bar returned to full. Today, it dropped to three bars prior to going out into the cold. Since the above post, there have been 300+ actual pages read--figure in setting bookmarks at the end of each "reading session", perhaps an average of five, and unsetting said bookmark when starting, not to mention three to five power down/up per day and the occasional menu browsing, accidental button pushing, etc., we'll say approx. 400 screen updates... that comes to approx 1600 screens for four bars (full battery), which seems to coincide with other observations here.

Perhaps there will be more page turns during the third and second bars, time will tell.

That provides the best of both:
1) can be left alone for months and batteries won't drain
2) can provide a lot of current for MP3 playing and other needs
3) still has plenty of juice for music and page turns
4) can rechargeYou left out cheap and easy to replace and upgrade as the tech continues to develop. :grin:

But then, I realize you weren't trying to make a comprehensive list. Those are just my two favorite aspects of rechargeable AA/AAA batteries. :nice:

I've had my reader (daily edition) for about two and a half months. I've read almost 4 books with it, 800+ pages per book, and all was well until about a week ago. I noticed that the charge time was reduced, and now, greatly reduced between charges. It's like the lithium battery has developed "memory", and is only good for a couple hours. There were a couple times I didn't let it completely discharge before recharging, but shouldn't have caused this. I just ordered a new battery, so we'll see.

Another "problem", the reader is also charged by plugging it into the USB port on a computer. I've been plugging it in, downloading various books I've converted to RTF, adjusting fonts, etc. So... unless someone downloads all the books they want to read for a month and never connects their reader to their computer in that time, we may never know!

Reminds me of the tootsie pop commercials. How many licks to get to the center of a tootsie pop. The world may never know... :shy:


But they do know how many licks, average is 252, LOL. Really haha. sorry couldn't resist. check it out yourself ----> http://www.tootsie.com/gal_machine.php

another factor, is one reading book after book, a breather of a day or so between books etc.....the things lose battery life just sitting unused as well.

Depends on whether asleep or shutdown as well... both my 300 and 650 hold full charge for month plus when shutdown and my 505 needs a charge every 10-14 days with several hours reading per day (and I'm a fast reader so that represents at least 2-300 pages per day) but only put to sleep :bookworm:


another factor, is one reading book after book, a breather of a day or so between books etc.....the things lose battery life just sitting unused as well.

Those of you who have the Reader already, could you comment on battery lifetime?

First thing.
The poll figures are invalid. The Sony ereaders can go for *weeks* between a charge, NOT just hours.

I last charged my 650 on 26/10/2010. 1 month ago today.
I haven't plugged into the computer in the last 3 weeks either; No new books to download.
The battery meter says the battery is still 75% full (3 bars) and it only dropped to that level on Tuesday this week. (23/11/2010)

Daily reading sessions total 3-5 hours.

Powered OFF between sessions not put in standby.

I charge my reader almost every two weeks, sometimes it'll last close to three weeks. I read an absolute minimum of two hours a day, everyday.

my PRS 500 would last FOREVER. 2-4 weeks but would die "suddenly" when it was time

I LOVE my new DX but the battery life is nothing like the sony. 2-5 days of heavy reading (while the sony would go 2+ weeks heavy reading) for me heavy reading is 4-8 hours a day. (yes thats radio off) I wish they would have used the space inside the DX to install a massive battery :-)

So... unless someone downloads all the books they want to read for a month and never connects their reader to their computer in that time,

An old post, but since it's been recently quoted...

I just spent a month on a ship, no internet access in that time, so the only time I connected my 300 to my laptop was to charge it. I did that once, when the battery indicator was down to 2 bars (of 4). I typically read 2-3 hours per day on the reader (also had access to pbooks) and tend to leave it on standby. I can't remember whether I charged it the day before I boarded, but on the assumption I did, I still got 2-3 weeks before I charged it, and it was not fully discharged when I did.