Mathematics/MathML in EPUB

AprilHare · 02-15-2010, 05:01 AM

Is anyone aware of a simple way to add mathematical formulae to EPUBs and expect them to be viewable on a liseuse, such as my firmware upgraded PRS-500?
I've been looking around at methods used in HTML:
1) MathML is popular in websites, but liseuses cannot handle it. And MathML is a pain to typeset by hand.
2) There are LaTeX to MathML CSS sheets available, which allows for easier-to-typeset LaTeX to be used however then you have the MathML display problem.
3) I know that Wikipedia supports mathematical script (looks very much like LaTeX) and the on-the-fly generated output is images/SVG. This would be better for EPUB. Something like that would be practical methinks.
4) You can use a dedicated program, make every single equation an image, then plug them manually into a EPUB. Very inconvenient.
Any ideas?
I was thinking along the lines of a 'MathML to image' processor which can take advantage of LaTeX to MathML somehow. Not sure if SVG is an option, anyone tested it?

Jellby · 02-15-2010, 07:02 AM

With the current state of affairs, I would go with the TeX -> image route, with a utility like tex2im. To make your life easier, you could include the TeX code in the HTML, either in an "alt" attribute or as a comment, and have a script automatically process all the needed formulas and generate the images. something like this:

HTML file:

Code:

<p>A nice identity:</p>
<img class="TeX" src="formula1.png" alt="e^{ix}=-1" />

and then have a script look for <img> elements with class="TeX", generate a temporary .tex file with the "alt" content, and run tex2im to create the file named in "src".

This script seems to use a similar idea.

KNotTed · 02-15-2010, 12:23 PM

There's also some information at http://svgkit.sourceforge.net/SVGLaTeX.html on converting LaTeX to SVG.

pietvo · 02-15-2010, 06:59 PM

You can also use pdflatex to convert the equations to PDF and then use pdf2svg to convert them to SVG. Or do it interactively with inkscape.

I am not sure, however, if all ereaders supporting ePub will do SVG properly.

AprilHare · 02-15-2010, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pietvo

You can also use pdflatex to convert the equations to PDF and then use pdf2svg to convert them to SVG. Or do it interactively with inkscape.

I am not sure, however, if all ereaders supporting ePub will do SVG properly.

Since these documents are for me, I need it to work with Sony Reader ePub implementation - or bust.

Peter Sorotokin · 02-15-2010, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AprilHare

Since these documents are for me, I need it to work with Sony Reader ePub implementation - or bust.

Sony Reader does SVG sufficiently well for math formulas.

Jellby · 02-16-2010, 03:54 AM

You could also try a direct MathML to SVG converter, like this.

bobcdy · 02-16-2010, 01:57 PM

Click image for larger version

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Another way is to use Word with Mathtype, create the equation, and then do a screen copy with Belltech CaptureXT Screen Capture. I've attached an image (I hope it works, this is the first such attachment I've tried)

rmm200 · 02-17-2010, 01:30 AM

Never is a long time - but I would say we will never get fonts that support math operations like this. Latex does a great job at it - and the people that need to create formulas probably already know it. Maybe what we need is a good Latex to HTML converter, which plugs the formulas in as SVG.

Robert

WillAdams · 02-17-2010, 08:03 AM

The fonts are coming:

http://www.stixfonts.com/

William

frabjous · 02-17-2010, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillAdams

The fonts are coming:

http://www.stixfonts.com/

William

At first, looking at this made me rather excited, until I saw that the glyphs are based on Times. I am so monumentally disappointed now that I want to cry. I am so sick of Times, and this thing has the danger of spreading over the sciences and other technical disciplines like the plague. Wouldn't it have been better to pick something that does better on low resolution screens anyway? Has anyone seen what Times looks like at low resolution recently?

But here's another question: do those ePub renderers that don't support SVG images do OK with a .PNG fallback? And if so, can anyone point me to the proper HTML snippet to use?

WillAdams · 02-17-2010, 01:18 PM

Well then you can use Calibria, Cambria, Candara, Constantia, &c.

Resolution shouldn't be an issue much longer as display density gets higher and operating systems finally become resolution independent.

William

frabjous · 02-17-2010, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillAdams

Well then you can use Calibria, Cambria, Candara, Constantia, &c.

Ugh. No. (1) those are owned by the despised Microsoft, if I'm not mistaken, and (2) they are not available for LaTeX.

Asana Math is promising. In the meantime, I'll probably just stick with my old standbys like the mathdesign fonts (URW Garamond, Bitstream Charter, Adobe Utopia), kp-fonts, and URW Palladio.

PaulTopping · 02-19-2010, 06:29 PM

You guys may be interested in the Ebooks for Math and Science group on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/groups?gid=1945452 (I am the group owner). Also, MathJax (http://www.mathjax.org) may also be of interest. If an ebook reader can do JavaScript, it can be used to render both TeX and MathML.

AprilHare · 02-20-2010, 05:14 AM

The beta STIX fonts seem good but unsure if licence would prevent redistribution.
I'd be interested in a howto for producing a working epub for Sony Reader with maths.

02-15-2010, 05:01 AM	#1
AprilHare Wizard Posts: 2,981 Karma: 11862367 Join Date: Apr 2008 Device: Sony Reader PRS-T2	Mathematics/MathML in EPUB Is anyone aware of a simple way to add mathematical formulae to EPUBs and expect them to be viewable on a liseuse, such as my firmware upgraded PRS-500? I've been looking around at methods used in HTML: 1) MathML is popular in websites, but liseuses cannot handle it. And MathML is a pain to typeset by hand. 2) There are LaTeX to MathML CSS sheets available, which allows for easier-to-typeset LaTeX to be used however then you have the MathML display problem. 3) I know that Wikipedia supports mathematical script (looks very much like LaTeX) and the on-the-fly generated output is images/SVG. This would be better for EPUB. Something like that would be practical methinks. 4) You can use a dedicated program, make every single equation an image, then plug them manually into a EPUB. Very inconvenient. Any ideas? I was thinking along the lines of a 'MathML to image' processor which can take advantage of LaTeX to MathML somehow. Not sure if SVG is an option, anyone tested it? Last edited by AprilHare; 02-15-2010 at 05:10 AM.

02-15-2010, 07:02 AM	#2
Jellby frumious Bandersnatch Posts: 7,546 Karma: 19001583 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Spaniard in Sweden Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura	With the current state of affairs, I would go with the TeX -> image route, with a utility like tex2im. To make your life easier, you could include the TeX code in the HTML, either in an "alt" attribute or as a comment, and have a script automatically process all the needed formulas and generate the images. something like this: HTML file: Code: <p>A nice identity:</p> <img class="TeX" src="formula1.png" alt="e^{ix}=-1" /> and then have a script look for <img> elements with class="TeX", generate a temporary .tex file with the "alt" content, and run tex2im to create the file named in "src". This script seems to use a similar idea.

02-16-2010, 01:57 PM	#8
bobcdy Fanatic Posts: 527 Karma: 1048576 Join Date: May 2009 Device: bebook; prs-950; nook simple touch; HTC Jetstream tablet	math equations Another way is to use Word with Mathtype, create the equation, and then do a screen copy with Belltech CaptureXT Screen Capture. I've attached an image (I hope it works, this is the first such attachment I've tried)

02-20-2010, 05:14 AM	#15
AprilHare Wizard Posts: 2,981 Karma: 11862367 Join Date: Apr 2008 Device: Sony Reader PRS-T2	The beta STIX fonts seem good but unsure if licence would prevent redistribution. I'd be interested in a howto for producing a working epub for Sony Reader with maths. Last edited by AprilHare; 02-20-2010 at 05:16 AM. Reason: less than unique thought :)

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02-15-2010, 12:23 PM	#3
KNotTed Member Posts: 19 Karma: 62 Join Date: Feb 2010 Device: PRS-505, PRS-600	There's also some information at http://svgkit.sourceforge.net/SVGLaTeX.html on converting LaTeX to SVG.

02-15-2010, 06:59 PM	#4
pietvo Reader Posts: 520 Karma: 24612 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Utrecht, NL Device: Kobo Aura 2, iPhone, iPad	You can also use pdflatex to convert the equations to PDF and then use pdf2svg to convert them to SVG. Or do it interactively with inkscape. I am not sure, however, if all ereaders supporting ePub will do SVG properly.

02-16-2010, 03:54 AM	#7
Jellby frumious Bandersnatch Posts: 7,546 Karma: 19001583 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Spaniard in Sweden Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura	You could also try a direct MathML to SVG converter, like this.

02-17-2010, 01:30 AM	#9
rmm200 Groupie Posts: 195 Karma: 414 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Bend, OR Device: Sony PRS-600	Never is a long time - but I would say we will never get fonts that support math operations like this. Latex does a great job at it - and the people that need to create formulas probably already know it. Maybe what we need is a good Latex to HTML converter, which plugs the formulas in as SVG. Robert

02-17-2010, 08:03 AM	#10
WillAdams Wizard Posts: 1,258 Karma: 3439432 Join Date: Feb 2008 Device: Amazon Kindle Paperwhite (300ppi), Samsung Galaxy Book 12	The fonts are coming: http://www.stixfonts.com/ William

02-17-2010, 01:18 PM	#12
WillAdams Wizard Posts: 1,258 Karma: 3439432 Join Date: Feb 2008 Device: Amazon Kindle Paperwhite (300ppi), Samsung Galaxy Book 12	Well then you can use Calibria, Cambria, Candara, Constantia, &c. Resolution shouldn't be an issue much longer as display density gets higher and operating systems finally become resolution independent. William

02-19-2010, 06:29 PM	#14
PaulTopping Junior Member Posts: 1 Karma: 10 Join Date: Feb 2010 Device: none	You guys may be interested in the Ebooks for Math and Science group on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/groups?gid=1945452 (I am the group owner). Also, MathJax (http://www.mathjax.org) may also be of interest. If an ebook reader can do JavaScript, it can be used to render both TeX and MathML.

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