Does any of the early adopters plan to hack into the iLiad?
Has anybody got some development tools, or some trick about how to do it?

To start with:
Which is the output of lsusb -v when the iLiad is attached to a linux host?
Does the current (v2.4) OS support wireless networking? If so, can you log using ssh or rsh, or to get transfers via scp, ftp, sftp?

it would be interesting if/what Nmap would find on both, the LAN and WLAN interfaces.

I guess I'll do some development once the sdk is out.

I doubt you can actually log into the machine. If they want to do DRM on it, they have to make sure nobody can tweak the running kernel, e.g., load modules. So they'll probably make the device appear as a usb storage device, not exposing the real root fs. Or worse, use a proprietary protocol.

But deep in my heart I hope there's an sshd running. That would make things so much easier... There are a lot of possibilities where you could try to "hack into" it -- the pdf viewer being based on xpdf with similar security flaws, for example. But that's way over my head.

and i doubt, that Irex could really think that they can keep that thing closed. As history has shown, even on Windows PDAs you get a embedded Linux up and running. So i think, for a device that is already running Linux, that should be a lot easier, especially if you have the source for the OS and the Kernel.

(Hint: www.gpl-violations.org - Linksys already knows them ;-) )

(Hint: www.gpl-violations.org - Linksys already knows them ;-) )

I love that hint, I forgot about the GPL (god bless it!). Looks like a bright future for us!

I love that hint, I forgot about the GPL (god bless it!). Looks like a bright future for us!
i think Linksys has more good then bad gotten from that. Think how many routers are running now on OpenWrt, DD-Wrt or some other alternative firmware. I'm in no doubt that all vendors of Broadcom-based routers made a good amount of additional sales because of the availability of the alternative firmwares.

Downside is naturally, that the users don't need to buy new hardware, as long as the firmware project of their choice is alive.

Personally, i would rather want my Iliad (if i order one) open, in the form of root access for me, then having the ability to read DRM'ed books. That would be a good reason to start learning real programming.

:D

i'm so going off topic here.

Hi,

does anybody know, how the update procedure works?

Do you have to connect the ilead to irex and hopefully a working update comes? (The way Microsoft dreams about, because it enables them to decide, what the best... )


Or can you download and store an update and decide by yourself what is the best...

Btw I think the SDK makes the second version neccessary.

Does anyone have any information about the SDK?

Gregor

The updates work like this:


"If you are registered to iDS you can skip this step and immediately connect to iDS to receive the latest software release. Due to the size of this release the download and installation will be done in two steps. After the successful installation of the first part you will need to reconnect to iDS again to download and install the second part.



(Note: Make sure that your iLiad is fully charged or connected to the power plug before starting the download.)



Connect to iDS by pressing the connect key of your iLiad for 2 seconds.
After the download your iLiad will shut itself down which can take up to 15 seconds.
When the screen turns white and the led goes out you can turn on your iLiad again and the installation of the new software release will automatically start.
After the new software has been installed you will need to restart your iLiad.


(Caution: Please make sure the iLiad does not run out of power while the new software is being installed. If the device runs out of power at this stage it may be programmed with incomplete software, rendering it unusable.)"


Taken from the email they sent today.

:
"If you are registered to iDS you can skip this step and immediately connect to iDS to receive the latest software release."

What does it happen if I can not grant a stable internet connection to iDS? Can I download the update first and then to use some local updater to upload it to the device? Has anybody had some experience with the update process?

This is a important thing. Please answer if you can help here.

the pdf viewer being based on xpdf with similar security flaws,
This is a seconday hope I have, but lets check first the easier things: networking, updating...

I'll answer when I can...I'll hopefully have my Iliad next week...^^

Does any of the early adopters plan to hack into the iLiad?
Has anybody got some development tools, or some trick about how to do it?


I think that development will have to wait until they release the SDK

First of all, we need to know:
- if the iliad uses uclibc or the complete glibc
- (optional) if the processor has floating point unit or not, and if it hasn't, what type of emulation is used (in-kernel fp emulation or soft-float compiled binaries)
- how to install new "viewers"
- what display "driver" they are using; I doubt they use an X server, it makes more sense for them to use something along the lines of FBDev.

The main limitaion right now is how to inject a new executable into the iliad and try it (if there is a security hole as in the librie and we can exec scripts in the SD/CF).

And after all, they should publish all this information with the SDL (one has to be able to test his viewer...).

BTW: I'm eager to start programming for the iliad. I've plenty of experience programming for small embedded linux platforms (for in-house use, but that includes gui and gui-less programs for the zaurus SL-5500 w/ SharpROM, ipaq w/ familiar, Zaurus SL-6000L w/ SharpROM, WRT54G w/OpenWRT, Asus WL-550g w/ Oleg Firmware), and it boils down to having a good crosscompiler toolchain and some patience to iron the bugs that appear when executing your app in the resource-starved embedded linux ;-).

The fact that the iliad will have an SDK has been a deciding factor for me (although the other contenders will have linux, programming for them will be a chore for some time until someone manages to "open" them... and I don't have the time nor the knowledge to do that myself -- well, perhaps some of the knowledge, but I'm sure not all that's needed (hey, I have my ego high today :wink: ))

Nice to know there are other developers waiting for their Iliads :rolleyes5

From previous ARM experience, emulated float point is very slow. This is important when using the pnmtools. Fortunately the netpbm package provides integer alternatives for the more usual manipulations.

[quote]
- what display "driver" they are using; I doubt they use an X server, it makes more sense for them to use something along the lines of FBDev.

Well fbdev >(or was it vfbdev?) is an xserver, only that it does not incorporate input devices. My strategy on another e-ink device was to use it, and then to use a simple script to capture the virtual framebuffer screen, reprocess into e-ink format, and dump into the real screen framebuffer. In this way I was able to run xclock.


The main limitaion right now is how to inject a new executable into the iliad and try it (if there is a security hole as in the librie and we can exec scripts in the SD/CF).
In the librie, the solution was to made a new firmware update incorporating an exec of script during init. It worked, but nobody become involved in the development. Perhaps as you say, the lack of a real SDK. I hope that iRex will deploy his [SDK] soon, but I am not sure if it is going to be free, so I keep considering the hacking alternative.


BTW: I'm eager to start programming for the iliad. I've plenty of experience programming for small embedded linux platforms (for in-house use, but that includes gui and gui-less programs for the zaurus SL-5500 w/ SharpROM, ipaq w/ familiar, Zaurus SL-6000L w/ SharpROM, WRT54G w/OpenWRT, Asus WL-550g w/ Oleg Firmware), and it boils down to having a good crosscompiler toolchain and some patience to iron the bugs that appear when executing your app in the resource-starved embedded linux ;-).

I agree. Myself I have crosscompiled for ARM but not really developed, just deployed packages. One of my students were assigned to the zaurus SL-5500, I asked him to write a new kernel module to simulate a usbmouse in the zaurus (so that the machine can be attached to the usb port of the host and start moving the cursor in the host screen without installing any software on it, just having the usbmouse driver loaded). He did it well, so even kernel hacking is a feasible possibility when one has got, as you say, a decent toolchain.

The specs of the Iliad look very similar to the GumStix board that ship with the eInk Developer kit. It would not surprize me if they simply have stuck the same board in the Iliad. You can download the SDK for the eInk kit on the eInk web site. Maybe a good starting point for hacking the Iliad.

The specs of the Iliad look very similar to the GumStix board that ship with the eInk Developer kit. It would not surprize me if they simply have stuck the same board in the Iliad. You can download the SDK for the eInk kit on the eInk web site. Maybe a good starting point for hacking the Iliad.
I am not sure. The processor model and speed seems the same, but the screen in the Eink kit is Gates' 800x600. The next Hollybook, the A51, was a 155ppi, 1280x900, so not the iLiad one.

But yep, the A51 prototype uses a GumStix too. So perhaps it is the same thing.

http://positron.org/projects/A51/sid_digest_2005_section_31-2_gates.pdf

- (optional) if the processor has floating point unit or not, and if it hasn't, what type of emulation is used (in-kernel fp emulation or soft-float compiled binaries)
The question of emulation, vfp versus fpa, was discussed time ago in the linuxarm-dev mailing list, but it was in the age of kernel 2.2. I expect better times are coming.

another interesting project to keep an eye on is the old one of Zaurus, around cacko.spy.org, pdaXrom.org and other sites.

...But yep, the A51 prototype uses a GumStix too. So perhaps it is the same thing.

http://positron.org/projects/A51/sid_digest_2005_section_31-2_gates.pdf
whoa, you know what?
if that prototype was available, i would buy that instead of the iliad. ok, i would loose WLAN and the Wacom screen and some additional (but not necessary) interfaces, but for an e-book, it would be good enough to me.

whoa, you know what?
if that prototype was available, .
It is interesting to note the last parragraph: "Special thanks to Philips Emerging Display Technologies for fabrication of the TFT array"

So while it is an e-ink prototype from Gates, the hardware has been done in coordination with the lab that also originated the irex spin-off.

yeah, i have seen that.
but i like Gates idea of the design more. I think one could have fitted the Iliads parts in a similar housing, not as bulky looking as the actual one does.
OT: Gates design looks more like "future" (can't say it better) and seems to be more overthought (all bulky parts on one side), while the Iliad looks like a oversized PDA, as some people already mentioned.

OT: Gates design looks more like "future" (can't say it better) and seems to be more overthought (all bulky parts on one side), while the Iliad looks like a oversized PDA, as some people already mentioned.
Gates takes advantage of artisan resin-based prototyping (he has even written a tutorial about, I believe) and manual component fitting while the commertial machines must be taylored for massive industrial production.

On the negative part, he never tooks the effort of putting an OS in these machines, as far as I have read.

I am understanding that the PDF reader is actually done by APABI, a company that already had developed a pdf reader for windows. This raises a lot of doubts. Has this company being able to port its software to unix? Is it running under emulation?

And it means the set of holes and bugs will not be the standard xpdf set.

I am understanding that the PDF reader is actually done by APABI, a company that already had developed a pdf reader for windows. This raises a lot of doubts. Has this company being able to port its software to unix? Is it running under emulation?

And it means the set of holes and bugs will not be the standard xpdf set.

Seriously, I don't think that we will need exploiting a hole to develop for the Iliad. Not when they're intending to release an SDK (call me optimist).

What i would prefer is that they load the uhci-hcd/ehci-hcd drivers in their embedded linux, and pressing some key combination on a attached usb keyboard forced the iliad to open a terminal instead of doing the normal init O:-). THAT would be useful (ok, an open ssh would be as useful as that ;-). Ok, it's just that the zaurus had that and it was very useful (albeit having and integrated "keyboard" made things somewhat easier).