View Full Version : Beginning to think that Ereader DRM will not happen


cvkemp
10-10-2009, 12:35 PM
It sure has been quit for a long time about the ereader DRM firmware and deals.
I wonder if it has been put down or just waiting because of B&Ns new ereader that has been reported

Chuck :chinscratch:

Musicman
10-10-2009, 03:10 PM
It sure has been quit for a long time about the ereader DRM firmware and deals.
I wonder if it has been put down or just waiting because of B&Ns new ereader that has been reported

Chuck :chinscratch:

I've been wondering myself....

It has been too quiet about E-Reader DRM, so I'm feeling like it might be a dead issue for us here.

I am curious about the IREX that was annnounced. They said it would be availabe soon at Best Buy, but the one nearest me here in NY only has Sonys.

6charlong
10-10-2009, 08:25 PM
I'm getting frustrated waiting too, but it's hard to imagine a company as big as B&N making a mistake on something this important. eReader is a legacy product. B&N doesn't need to have "tech savvy" to understand what that means; surely they've been around long enough to understand.

There are rumors of at least two new ebook readers with eReader support being released before the holidays. On B&N's own WEB site one of their most used threads is a pleading from many customers for eReader support for Linux. There seems to be a critical mass building up.

One would think that nobody needs to remind B&N that selling books is what they do. Copying Amazon, a department store that sells all sorts of products, is a snipe hunt for B&N. In a future where ebooks are increasingly how books are published, getting as many readers needing books in the hands of as many customers needing content as possible has to be the key to profit in B&N's market.

In the meantime my own wishlist at B&N keeps growing while I wait for content I can read on a real screen. And in the meantime innovators like ShortCovers, which sells ePub editions with their own iPod app so I can read their product on my iPod, Sony or PPro, are taking market share that B&N may not be able to get back. The longer B&N delays the more serious challenges like that to their real core business there will be. They have to realize this as well as we can. On the other hand, Keynes's "animal spirits" seem to rule the business world at the moment. :blink:

Faenad
10-10-2009, 08:48 PM
B&N have a big press event planned for the 20th of October. They will probably present theirs readers and theirs ebooks plan.

bbusybookworm
10-10-2009, 09:14 PM
I agree its a bit frustrating as most of the Books I buy are also in the eReader format.

However, as RobertB has always been pretty open about suff like this I'll assume that if it was not happening, it'll have been mentioned. Thought he mentioned recently, his company is not very happy with him being a little too open at times so he's probably not going to tell us much about ongoing negotiation and development.

Still the takeover of eReader by B&N, and the fact that no other dedicated device supports eReader at present probably means that a lot more work has to be done to develop device specific support, while taking care to ensure that the core code is easily portable to new devices as they come along.

Also keep in mind that eReader was talking about moving to ePUB as well, but with their own DRM, you have nice recipe for slowing things down.

Musicman
10-11-2009, 09:22 AM
Thought he mentioned recently, his company is not very happy with him being a little too open at times so he's probably not going to tell us much about ongoing negotiation and development.

Still the takeover of eReader by B&N, and the fact that no other dedicated device supports eReader at present probably means that a lot more work has to be done to develop device specific support, while taking care to ensure that the core code is easily portable to new devices as they come along.

Also keep in mind that eReader was talking about moving to ePUB as well, but with their own DRM, you have nice recipe for slowing things down.

As I understand it, the only issue that was left was the licensing agreement.

I noticed that Eslick also hasn't gotten approval for E-reader support.

Hopefully, B&N is not being restrictive in their licensing...

cvkemp
10-11-2009, 10:41 AM
What I am hopeing is that when B&N annouces their ereader that will free things up for the other ereaders to get it too.
I can not see B&N being like Amazon because every time I am in B&N I hear over and over that we will not be like Amazon from the management.


Chuck

cvkemp
10-13-2009, 10:14 AM
Sorry Robert but I have 5 kids and 10 grandkids so I know how to stir up a pot.


Chuck :)

Musicman
10-13-2009, 01:08 PM
Could be Robertb's silence means its not a dead issue...

If it were a dead issue, I would think he would let us know.

JSWolf
10-13-2009, 01:12 PM
To be honest, I'm hoping it is a dead issue as eReader is an obsolete format.

emoorman
10-13-2009, 03:13 PM
The eReader site says they are working toward this in the near future?, whatever this is.

I have over 130 ereader books already and would like to port them over to something with a larger and better screen than a Palm or Windows Mobile phone.

nomad
10-13-2009, 03:35 PM
I did ask Robert B about eReader support and I was told:

***
We are working every day on getting a final contract from Barnes & Noble that is acceptable. I am under an NDA so cannot say much... but we want it very badly and are praying for something acceptable daily!
***

Regards,

Michal

Robertb
10-13-2009, 03:42 PM
Dear All:

We share your enthusiasm for getting eReader onto our devices. Every day we are working towards this.

The hold up is getting an acceptable contract from Barnes & Noble (who now owns Fictionwise). The NDA we have prevents me from providing much info. If I do, it would violate the NDA and we would lose eReader. So, I keep quiet pressing and pressing my contact at Fictionwise who is working furiously to make this happen.

In a nutshell, the issue is not cost... it is exclusivity! We want to put BOTH formats on the same device. Adobe is fine with this; but Barnes & Noble needs to approve of this idea. We hear that a decision is finally close.

I wish I could tell you more and have a letter writing campaign to bring this about. I cannot. The issue is anything but dead, the resolve is still there, and every day we are working on getting something accomplished towards the goal! This is still on our front burner!!

cvkemp
10-13-2009, 04:04 PM
Thanks Robert I believe I said earlier that I felt that it was delayed due to B&N getting ready to annouce their ereader

Thanks again

Chuck

AnemicOak
10-13-2009, 04:15 PM
In a nutshell, the issue is not cost... it is exclusivity! We want to put BOTH formats on the same device. Adobe is fine with this; but Barnes & Noble needs to approve of this idea. We hear that a decision is finally close.


That's weird. The new I-Rex device is supposed to have both ADE and eReader on it when it comes out later this month.

griffonwing
10-13-2009, 04:18 PM
In a nutshell, the issue is not cost... it is exclusivity! We want to put BOTH formats on the same device. Adobe is fine with this; but Barnes & Noble needs to approve of this idea. We hear that a decision is finally close.


Exclusivity. Is B&N trying to be the same with eReader DRM as Amazon is with their stranglehold on Mobi DRM?

All this is going to do is keep people from purchasing the eReader DRM files.

There are books on Amazon that I would love to purchase, but i will not, simply because they are exclusive to Amazon, whether it be their proprietary format or DRM Mobi.

Sony is converting their entire library of books to the ePub format, and this will open up the Sony library to a vast number of people, regardless of device.

Barnes & Noble! Take a tip from Sony. Drop the proprietary exclusive idea. It is bunk, and will only put a stranglehold on your own corporate throats. It's moving backwards, not forwards.

cvkemp
10-13-2009, 04:28 PM
If B&N decided that its ereader DRM must be the only one then I will cancel my club membership with them and I have stopped shopping Amazon.

I hope the both of them are watching the Forum and read this.

Chuck

wallcraft
10-13-2009, 04:36 PM
The new I-Rex device is supposed to have both ADE and eReader on it when it comes out later this month. Yes, everything we have heard suggests that the DR800SG will have eReader and Adobe. For example, from IREX turns page on eReaders with latest Digital Reader (http://i-to-i.irexnet.com/2009/09/23/irex-turns-page-on-ereaders-with-latest-digital-reader/): in addition it supports multiple formats including industry standard ePub format and multiple DRM solutions, rather than a single, “closed” proprietary format that locks content to a specific device. The multiple DRM solutions have to be eReader and Adobe.

I repeat my prediction that Astak will get the go ahead for eReader DRM once B&N releases their own device, probably on Oct 20th (Barnes & Noble E-Reader Could Come Oct 20 With Lending Options (http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58895)).

cvkemp
10-13-2009, 05:15 PM
That is what I am thinking also.

Chuck

Elfwreck
10-13-2009, 05:30 PM
Yes, everything we have heard suggests that the DR800SG will have eReader and Adobe. For example, from IREX turns page on eReaders with latest Digital Reader (http://i-to-i.irexnet.com/2009/09/23/irex-turns-page-on-ereaders-with-latest-digital-reader/): The multiple DRM solutions have to be eReader and Adobe.

You think so? Not DRM for both ePub and PDF?

EReader & Adobe would seem to make sense, yes. But I don't see anything that specifically says they have both of those forms of DRM. I couldn't find any technical listings at all. And their reader comparison chart (http://www.irexreader.com/pdf/IREX-comparison-readers.pdf) (pdf) is flawed--it says Sony supports "Adobe PDF, EPUB, BBeB, TXT," but doesn't mention RTF, and that the iRex will support "Adobe PDF, EPUB, Newspaper Direct, Fictionwise, eReader, TXT."

What's "fictionwise" format? And is "newspaper direct" a proprietary format? (I poked around at http://newspaperdirect.com; I expect the digital version to be ePub-ish. Or PDF-ish, which would be unpleasant.)

Robertb
10-13-2009, 06:00 PM
Exclusivity. Is B&N trying to be the same with eReader DRM as Amazon is with their stranglehold on Mobi DRM?

All this is going to do is keep people from purchasing the eReader DRM files.

There are books on Amazon that I would love to purchase, but i will not, simply because they are exclusive to Amazon, whether it be their proprietary format or DRM Mobi.

Sony is converting their entire library of books to the ePub format, and this will open up the Sony library to a vast number of people, regardless of device.

Barnes & Noble! Take a tip from Sony. Drop the proprietary exclusive idea. It is bunk, and will only put a stranglehold on your own corporate throats. It's moving backwards, not forwards.

Dear Griffie:

Fictionwise is aware that they NEED to be on as many devices as possible. Now, all we have to do is get B&N to go along and do what is best for Fictionwise.

Musicman
10-21-2009, 05:58 PM
Dear Griffie:

Fictionwise is aware that they NEED to be on as many devices as possible. Now, all we have to do is get B&N to go along and do what is best for Fictionwise.

Now that the B&N Ereader has been released - they say that Ereader support in Adobe ADE Epub will be coming and that they are looking to move to entirely to Epub. Does that mean it will eventually be coming to the Pocket Pro in the form of ADE?

jwsheets
10-21-2009, 06:20 PM
I just spoke to a rep at B&N. He said that the epub and pdf books they will be offering will be exclusive to the Nook or their software, they have no plans to broaden the scope to include other readers at this time.

Also, spoke to a Sony rep who said the same thing. Although they are moving to epub as their format, the epubs are in pdb format with drm exclusive to Sony readers with no plan to offer them to other reader devices.

wallcraft
10-21-2009, 07:02 PM
I just spoke to a rep at B&N. He said that the epub and pdf books they will be offering will be exclusive to the Nook or their software, they have no plans to broaden the scope to include other readers at this time.

Also, spoke to a Sony rep who said the same thing. Although they are moving to epub as their format, the epubs are in pdb format with drm exclusive to Sony readers with no plan to offer them to other reader devices. Both reps are wrong, or at least "no plans to broaden the scope" does not mean that other devices are excluded. See Adobe and Barnes & Noble eBook Collaboration (http://blogs.adobe.com/billmccoy/2009/10/adobe-and-barne.html). There is only one DRM provider, Adobe, and any device fully supporting ADE will be able to read any DRMed ePub. Reader vendors are free not to fully implement ADE, but ebook providers have no way I am aware of to lock ePubs to a subset of ADE devices.

Robertb
10-21-2009, 08:06 PM
That's weird. The new I-Rex device is supposed to have both ADE and eReader on it when it comes out later this month.


Dear All:

The word I am getting on the contract to bring eReader to the EZ Reader line is that Barnes and Noble lawyers have been totally tied up with their plans for their own eBook Reader (announced yesterday) and their negotiations with Adobe.

I am told that now that this is done and announced they hope they can tend to smaller matters like allowing Astak to get an actual copy of a contract. We cannot get eReader without a contract and it has been stalled for five months.

God willing, it will now move forward.

AnemicOak
10-21-2009, 08:16 PM
Is this something Astak specific or is this something Jinke is working on for all of their resellers?

Musicman
10-22-2009, 06:40 PM
Dear All:

The word I am getting on the contract to bring eReader to the EZ Reader line is that Barnes and Noble lawyers have been totally tied up with their plans for their own eBook Reader (announced yesterday) and their negotiations with Adobe.

I am told that now that this is done and announced they hope they can tend to smaller matters like allowing Astak to get an actual copy of a contract. We cannot get eReader without a contract and it has been stalled for five months.

God willing, it will now move forward.

Thanks for the update!

I see it only as a positive for B&N to have their ereader software on the Astak devices. After all, B&N says they want to be on more devices.

oncdoc
10-22-2009, 07:03 PM
im still kinda a newbie, whats soo greater about adobe ereader ? why do we care?

Musicman
10-22-2009, 07:23 PM
im still kinda a newbie, whats soo greater about adobe ereader ? why do we care?

I have almost all my books in ereader format, and I would like to be able to read them on my Pocket Pro (I know you can liberate them, but it would be nice to not have to).