Already the introduction paragraph doesn't bode well:

Sony on Thursday announced the latest version of its own digital book offering, called Reader PRS700, complete with several flashy features that in some respects outshine the Kindle's--along with a few drawbacks that practically guarantee the new device won't steal Amazon's lead in the nascent U.S. digital-reader market.

They go on explaining that Sony still lacks Amazon's popular content at a reasonable price, along with the Kindle's wireless capabilities. And quoting Forrester Research analyst James McQuivey:

Kindle can't really be threatened because it's the only one with a wireless store built into it, and that's an amazing convenience. The Sony Reader has always been a good device. But without that critical content piece, an e-book is just a bunch of wires and a screen."

Another analyst, Ross Rubin from NPD, criticizes the fact that the new Sony costs more than the Kindle, more than most consumers would be willing to pay.

Link: http://www.forbes.com/technology/2008/10/02/sony-digital-reader-tech-personal-cx_ag_1002sony.html

I willing to pay even more , just put back tha damn page turning buttons !

I willing to pay even more , just put back tha damn page turning buttons !
It does have page turn buttons, stop complaining.

It does have page turn buttons, stop complaining.

No , it has menu buttons that can turn pages and they are at the middle of the screen. Thats not usable. Buttons should be under your finger.

Then stick with your 505, perhaps? :wink:

Then stick with your 505, perhaps? :wink:

Indeed , that's the decision.

...And I'm not impressed with Forbes not being impressed.

No , it has menu buttons that can turn pages and they are at the middle of the screen. Thats not usable. Buttons should be under your finger.
Have you actually looked at the pictures? The buttons are placed to be right under the left thumb.

Indeed , that's the decision.The important bit is that you find something that works for you. :yes:

...And I'm not impressed with Forbes not being impressed.I've never been very impressed with Forbes' impressions, myself.

Have you actually looked at the pictures? The buttons are placed to be right under the left thumb.

Where ?


http://www.mobileread.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16733&d=1222986855

I see only 7 buttons under the screen , the 2nd and 3rd from the left appears to be page turns , non of them "under my thumb" if you can please point where is the buttons you talking about I will really appreciate this, hell I even will buy this device :)

If you were to hold it by the bottom border the two page turn buttons (2nd and 3rd from the left) would be more or less under thumb.

If you were to hold it by the bottom border the two page turn buttons (2nd and 3rd from the left) would be more or less under thumb.

Sorry for "fighting" you guys it was not my intention but:

1. To use this you have to use LEFT hand again as in 500.

2. The "page back" is lot closer to "under the thumb" than page forward which is not good if you going to press it with thumb.

3. You will have to either remove it from the cover or "break" the cover to another side to use it that way.

Not fighting at all, Lord KiRon! Discussing! :pleased:

And in continuance of that discussion: I agree, that would only work for left-handed holding. I don't think the cover would be an issue, it seems to be the same as the 505's cover, and that folds all the way back just fine.

I've never paid much attention to any of the big news outlets opinions of e-books or readers.

As mentioned on an earlier thread, more often then not, they pay moreattention to what the PR hacks say and less to the actual product. And they hardly ever appear to have actually used the device in question :wall:

And while I agree that the Price is more expensive then the Kindle, you do get what you pay for, and the 700 does look a lot better. Add the Capability of the touch screen, and the inherent flexibility of the soft keyboard compared to hard buttons which means that Sony could easily drop in more options without having to worry about what buttons already exist.

I'm thinking that Sony is actually planning for the International market with this. After all, how much easier is it to add a soft keyboard / options for a foreign language then it would be to get region specific hardware key's.

The wireless would have been nice, but internationally, 3G is a pain, and Wifi while simple for geek's like us is not that easy to configure for most people.

@Lord KiRon
The answer is simple. Wait for Igor firmware hack and program the buttons the way you want...
Anyway, it's too soon to decide either way. Wait for the first Youtube video... the first hater review... allow yourself to be surprised, maybe you'll find the touchscreen actually comfortable.

@Lord KiRon
The answer is simple. Wait for Igor firmware hack and program the buttons the way you want...
Anyway, it's too soon to decide either way. Wait for the first Youtube video... the first hater review... allow yourself to be surprised, maybe you'll find the touchscreen actually comfortable.

Thanks, I actually more likely to wait for Igor's hack to implement russian :)

As for buttons NatCh, it's not really like 500 where you hold with left hand but in the middle , here its lower left corner ...
I need to get use to the idea and "pilot" it when some of my friends will get reader.

Other options of reader look good, it's a buttons on the middle right I missing :)

I will be waiting for a more comprehensive review of how well the touchscreen interface works.

I have limited use of my left thumb, and that does present a problem for me. but if the touch interface allows for easy one handed page turning via the right thumb... it could all be good.

I am impressed so far with the other details of the PRS700... might be worth selling the old 505 and investing in the 700.

I agree, that would only work for left-handed holding.

I'm right-handed... why mother? WHHHHY?!

Seriously though, I must say I don't like the omission of the convenient page-turn buttons, although I'm quite sure I'd find a way to live with the touch-turning.

I wonder how much the Kindle would actually cost if Amazon added in a touchscreen and a frontlight. I bet it would go over the $400 price mark. So Forbes saying that the 700 is too expensive is crazy. Look at all the people who purchased the Kindle before the price dropped.

I wonder how much the Kindle would actually cost if Amazon added in a touchscreen and a frontlight. I bet it would go over the $400 price mark. So Amazon's saying that the 700 is too expensive is crazy. Look at all the people who purchased the Kindle before the price dropped.

I was willing to spend $400 when the Sony 505 was a lot less to get things like search, annotation and dictionary look up. This hardware seems quite worth the price to me. Sure, we'd all like them to be $99 but that's just not going to happen for awhile.

As for the page buttons, I do prefer having them on both sides, but I'm right handed and usually hold my Kindle with my left hand. So does my husband. Still, it's not fair to leave the lefties out in the cold. I would hope by now they'd look at all the popular hacks out there and start integrating some of them, like programmable buttons. However, while I like a left-side button, I don't hold at the bottom, so that wouldn't be an ideal place for me. I think it's hard to find a button layout that works for everyone. I find the Kindle highly ergonomic. My husband has adjusted to his but naturally holds his books even higher up than I do. It's less than ideal for him. I think with any device you use a lot, you do adjust and you end up working it without even thinking about it after awhile.

I'm right-handed... why mother? WHHHHY?!

I hold my 505 in my right hand, close to the left side (holding both the reader and the cover - like I do for an open paperback's left and right side) - the left side buttons are absolutely at the right place to reach with my thumb. I hardly use the bottom-right arrows or the two page turner buttons on the right side. So pressing buttons on the left for a right-handed is not a big issue IMHO.

"Kindle can't really be threatened because it's the only one with a wireless store built into it, and that's an amazing convenience. The Sony Reader has always been a good device. But without that critical content piece, an e-book is just a bunch of wires and a screen."

That's the epitome of American consumistic convenience. Critical content piece ?!? It's not like you digest books in a second's worth, so why would I need the whole world of books always at my fat lazy fingertips ? It drains more battery, too.

No wireless is like having a computer without the Internet connection. Not a usable experience.

Also the touch-screen and the front-light are gimmicks. Cause the touch-screen isn't precise enough to be used to annotate using the stylus.

No wireless is like having a computer without the Internet connection. Not a usable experience.

Also the touch-screen and the front-light are gimmicks. Cause the touch-screen isn't precise enough to be used to annotate using the stylus.

My experience with the PRS500/505 has been quite usable, I'm sure.

It's not even nearly like having no internet connection on a computer. No connectivity on the Reader can be resolved with a computer, whereas if the computer has not a connection all is damned.

Device details aside, the article is right to point out that CONTENT is Sony's weak link vs. Amazon, and that isn't entirely Sony's fault. Their mistake was trying to become a bookseller in direct competition with Amazon. If they had decided to do what they do (hardware) and had partnered with Amazon's competition for content, then we'd have a more competitive situation. Borders.com, for example. But instead of creating a true e-bookstore with Borders, Borders just links back to the Sony store. Ridiculous.

Sony has committed to 100,000 eBooks by the end of the year. That's a good start to solve the content problem.

as a sidenote on the left hand, in landscape, where do the buttons go? to the left or to the right hand?

And about the 700, does the 700 happen to have any side buttons?
I wasn't sure, but somewhere in my memory I remember a device with buttons on the side; could be another one...

About the price, I do agree it's a bit much seeing the 505 goes over ebay at 225-250.
For the 700, a price like 350 would have been more justified.

But perhaps either Sony will surprise us, with a better than expected device, or the price will drop somewhat in the coming months to year.

About the price, I do agree it's a bit much seeing the 505 goes over ebay at 225-250.
For the 700, a price like 350 would have been more justified.


You can't compare list price to street price.

The 505 MSRP is $299, the 700 MSRP is $399. In fact, those are the prices SonyStyle sells it for.

I'm sure we will see the 700 come down to a street price of around $350 after its out for a few months. Generally for new devices the retailers know that early adopters will pay full MSRP because they want it NOW.

BOb

I've tried the 700 in the store, and I didn't find a problem with the page-turn buttons... in fact, once I tried the "finger-slide" page turn method, I never used the page-turn buttons. The ergonomics work for me.

Pretty much the only thing I agree with Forbes on, is the too-high price of the 700. Bring it down to $300 or below, and I'll consider it. Bring it down to $200 and I wouldn't think twice... I'd be on it like white on rice.

Lacking wireless book access is really no big deal... being able to connect, once you get home (or, potentially, at a bookstore while shopping) would work fine for me. And the Sony handles more formats, so although the Sony bookstore may not match Amazon, adding the catalogs of other e-book stores makes up for it.

Bottom line, I'll be watching it, but not seriously until after the second half of '09 at the earliest, I'm sure.

You know, knowing what's coming, what's going to be released is a good thing but also sucks big time!

It's the anticiapation of something better in the horizon that excites me, but the wait untill it's there kind of is a bit dissapointing.

I wished Sony would sell to consumers already in their store (like limited to 1 purchase per person, perhaps for a bit more expensive price). That way we'd already have some nice reviews!. Reviews probably will be able to keep me alive for the next 3 weeks until it's official release...

The way things are now, I'd probably not have another ebook for the coming month, or maybe even longer...

I went to the Sony Style store in Paramus earlier this week to fondle the prs 700 and I found the page turn buttons on the left to be quite usable. For a few a seconds I too thought that they should have had buttons on the right but the swiping is so natural that there really is no need for buttons on the right. I found that the keyboard was large enough to be easily used with your fingers and it registers a lot faster then the kindle does. Typing on the kindle is quite annoying due to the slow registration of button press. I also like the speed of the device, I am hopefully going to get this thing near release, and am looking rather forward to it.

I wonder how much the Kindle would actually cost if Amazon added in a touchscreen and a frontlight. I bet it would go over the $400 price mark. So Forbes saying that the 700 is too expensive is crazy. Look at all the people who purchased the Kindle before the price dropped.

I wonder how much the Sony would cost if Sony started selling books at more reasonable prices??

No wireless is like having a computer without the Internet connection. Not a usable experience.

Also the touch-screen and the front-light are gimmicks. Cause the touch-screen isn't precise enough to be used to annotate using the stylus.

Now, I disagree with both of those statements. Mind you, I have no desire to own a Sony reader, there is very little about it that appeals to me.

However, I don't see the front light as a gimmick. I've seen enough of the front light style book lights for the Sony to think they are a big step up from your average book light.

Also, not having wireless is not that big a deal, really. I use my wireless connection on my Kindle so seldom (probably once a month max ... maybe twice if I find myself out and about and really keen on seeing if a particular book is available for the Kindle at Amazon.com). If it went away tomorrow, I would miss it from time to time, but I'd get over it.

And ... not from your post, but from others, I really wonder where it is that all of you seem to have this strange idea that Kindle owners can only purchase books from Amazon?? Or that there are so many limitations on format that we are somehow unable to access books from other sources?

I'm glad you all like your Sonys ... stick with what you like; it's a good rule to live by. But, I swear, you all act like Amazon and the Kindle mean certain death for your favorite reader. There is room in the world marketplace for more than one device.

it's just that the wireless feat on the kindle only allows you to go browsing on wikipedia and Amazon.
I find it an amazing feat to include Wikipedia in the kindle's ability to browse around!
However, I do not feel that a wireless connection that only gives me a huge encyclopedia for study purposes for free, and a huge library of books for purchase a gadget that would make me turn my head..
If Amazon could give internet access for say 5 to $10 per month, then I would definately buy it!
Appart from a few forums, and mail I don't really need internet, but am currently paying like what..$30 per month?
Ofcourse, if amazon would include a cheap payed internet for free, then they will most likely cap the monthly volume

What is with the ignorance regarding the kindle on this forum? Anywhere else it could be expected and while the kindle has some major usability flaws that are really getting to me, the device is quite capable. The internet connection on the kindle is full featured in that you can browse the web fairly normally on the device. I am sure there are plenty of sites that do not work but a lot do. The other funny idea people have is that people you are bound by the wireless connection and can not connect to a computer. I only mention that because I find it funny.

Anyway, I think most people owning an ebook reader also have a
cell phone featuring 3G or EDGE. Isn't it much better to browse
with opera mini on a color lcd screen (even if it's small) than with
an ebook reader?

And for those who really wanna be able to download new books anywhere, wouldn't
it be smarter to make ebook readers able to use cell phones 3G/edge/...
modems (via bluetooth) ? That would definitely be much more flexible
(and eco-friendly) since otherwise you would need to have integrated
Wifi+3G+Edge+Wimax support to satisfy everyone.

Anyway, I think most people owning an ebook reader also have a
cell phone featuring 3G or EDGE.

I'm doubtful of this, as while a minority , i.e. the early adaptors may have had it, the majority may not.

Also while people may have the facility available on the phone, a very small percentage are aware of it at actually use it with any regularity.

Data rates, until recently were pretty high, and even now can still be quiet expensive if you don't have a package.


And for those who really wanna be able to download new books anywhere, wouldn't
it be smarter to make ebook readers able to use cell phones 3G/edge/...
modems (via bluetooth) ? That would definitely be much more flexible
(and eco-friendly) since otherwise you would need to have integrated
Wifi+3G+Edge+Wimax support to satisfy everyone.

Again, I'm doubtful, as its adds another layer of difficulty, which kind of defeats the plug and play mentality of the Kindle, where you don't have to think about connecting, it just is.

Bluetooth can be a real, pain, especially networking as while there is a standard, it is still treated is its own way by different companies, and if its such a pain with PC's or even PDA's its going to be more difficuly with a simpler device like a Reader, not unless they put in more powerful systems.

As such while Geek's like us may enjoy and use it, I'm doubtful of the general public.

I also think it's a great idea, to use the download capabilities of the phone! however,I know few people who actually are able to browse on their laptops through a cellphone connection,let alone an e-reader.
I myself have difficulty enabling the internet on my phone, and like mentioned the price is just way too high. Besides anything non 3G (like eg standard data transfert through cellphone signal) costs about $1 per minute @ a speed of like 112kbits/sec?
that's less than 13kB/s.
I remember I bought a game in a store for my cellphone a while ago, which costed me $11, and $4 to register (enable) it via the internet.
That's not going to convince me to ever buy another game again on my cell.
Ever since then I stopped using my cell as an internet device.

So when prices drop to an equivalent of home internet (say either $24 per month with same speeds, or price adjusted relative to the speed,options of one time internet instead of a monthly subscription, or just like calling tariff per minute) I might consider using a service like that.

Well just for info sake data prices in the Uk have dropped quiet a bit in the last year or so.

Basic packages with about a gig of bandwith start at £5 with an average between £10-15.

But these price drops are pretty recent and require you to have it on your plan or to buy the add on in advance otherwise the price is still high.

And most people who've had similar bad experiences, I.e. Being hit with high data charges are pretty sceptic and often refuse to believe the drops and don't want to risk it.

Am I the only one that is happy the Reader doesn't have wifi? I for one would rather have the extra battery life than the ability to download at will.

Not saying that isn't the case for everyone...

Am I the only one that is happy the Reader doesn't have wifi? I for one would rather have the extra battery life than the ability to download at will.

Not saying that isn't the case for everyone...

Ahh nevermind, missed pages 2 and 3 of this thread...

No wireless is like having a computer without the Internet connection. Not a usable experience.

Also the touch-screen and the front-light are gimmicks. Cause the touch-screen isn't precise enough to be used to annotate using the stylus.

Wow! Have we so forgotten already the time when the internet was really not part of mainstream society? It was only a little over 10 years ago. I would not say a computer without internet connection is "not a useable experience". It certainly can be used for lots of things. A lot of us use the word processor and a computer without internet access can still do those things.

Wow! Have we so forgotten already the time when the internet was really not part of mainstream society? It was only a little over 10 years ago. I would not say a computer without internet connection is "not a useable experience". It certainly can be used for lots of things. A lot of us use the word processor and a computer without internet access can still do those things.

I agree. Anyone who says that obviously did not derive hours of pleasure from Oregon Trail.

Best. Game. Ever. Rocked it on my Apple IIGS.

For the record, if I hold my reader in my right hand toward the bottom, the buttons line up with my right thumb. Still I find myself doing the thumb swipe instead because it's easiest for me.

We thought our commodor 64 was useful :)

Wow talk about necromancy...