OK, so I spent about 20 minutes today playing around with a Sony PRS-505 in Borders today. My first impression when I saw it, was that it was just a fake demo unit. I forgot E-ink doesn't emit light. Very cool. Love the crispness of the display, even the sample pictures looked good.

But the refresh rate, which I know is not horribly slow is still light years below the iphone and pdas I've owned. I know they are two completely different technologies, but as much as a pain it is to convert and split books into chapters for my iphone, I've gotten used to the fact that I can tap the screen and the page flips instantaneously or I can flick my finger and scroll down the page. I love that part of the experience of reading on the iphone, but the screen is just too small and battery life sucks.

So maybe I'm spoiled, as I've been reading ebooks for years on PDAs, but the thing is I don't know if I can get past this point.

Like in some books, there are passages that the author is just rambling and I like to skip through and flip past the section, but there is no flipping on an e-ink device.

I definitely see the advantages of e-ink: Battery Life, Paper-like Quality, but I'm still not sold on it completely.

Just press the page button on the second last sentence of the page and you should be fine. With a paperback book you have to change the page as well. I doubt this goes faster than the eInk device :D

As joblack said, you adapt to the speed of e-ink. Depending on the size of the text and your reading speed you will find the best time to press the page advance button. I use the time of the page turn to look away from the screen so that my eyes can refocus on a distant object. For me that avoids eye strain. I do the same thing with a pbook.

I don't see it as slow at all, didn't even when I first read a book on it

I find the Vizplex screens to be good for page turning. It's no worse then being on the right side of a pBook and then having to turn the page and then reposition your eyes to the top left to continue reeding. You just get used to turning the page and it's not any slower then your pBook.

Like in some books, there are passages that the author is just rambling and I like to skip through and flip past the section, but there is no flipping on an e-ink device.

I definitely see the advantages of e-ink: Battery Life, Paper-like Quality, but I'm still not sold on it completely.


The Sony has a page advance feature where you can hold down the next page button and advance exactly 10 pages, but that is probably too much to qualify as 'flipping' through a section.

I just got a Jetbook reader to add to my menagerie of ebook readers. It is the only one I have that is LCD rather than eink. It took an hour or so for me to notice there was no flash when the page refreshed, I guess I was that used to the flash.

However, if you are the sort of person who notices the flash then it would be more of a hindrance for you. The 1150 is also LCD and (I guess) refreshes instantly, like a computer or like my Jetbook.

The tradeoff is diminished battery life for a LCD device. And the type on the Jetbook is noticeably pixellated if you look at it closely, when compared with the eink devices.

I have a frankline ebookman 901 (you get them very cheap off ebay these days), (I got it when it was slightly more expensive :p). It has a 5 inch lcd screen so no flashes (though the bottom one inch is for navigation). It can read mobipocket, has a calender, address book, even an earphone outlet. So in short it is quite comparable to a pda. Now not all lcd’s are alike. This one has a black and white one. However, IMO, for reading ebooks, a black and white (grey) screen is much easier on eyes than a coloured one. So far so good - but what really puts me off is the battery life. Ebm uses 2 AAA batteries and they get consumed very fast. Also, a 4 inch (effective) screen means lot more page turns (even though turning pages is very easy. It has a touch screen and even a jog wheel) than an average p book. SO what I am looking for in my next reader is a bigger screen and a longer battery life. Of course, if the screen is non reflective, all the better (like I have "heard" eink is). Ebookman can get really annoying if you want to lie down and read as screen becomes unreadable. Now a six inch eink device, (though I have yet to see one in person), I feel, is not really likely to be a major improvement over a 5 inch one, so I want to wait for the 9.7 inch one. I guess, what I am trying to say is that page turn flashes would perhaps not be a big deal if one finds that there are other clear advantages (longer battery life, larger non reflective screen, in my case) in eink readers.

After a few hours of using an eInk reader you no longer even notice the "flash" and page turn. The page turn speed on the modern VizPlex screens which the Sony, CyBook, and Kindle all use is about half a second - that's a lot faster than you can turn the page of a paper book.

It's not an issue.

I stopped noticing it after a few minutes, myself. That was over 18 months ago, I don't even think about it anymore unless someone asks if you get used to it. :nice:

The longer answer is that there are some, very few folks who just can't get used to it, it drives them completely nuts. If it wasn't really bugging you a lot in the store, you probably are not one of these unfortunate few.

I have the same experience as most. After a few minutes reading, the flash was not even noticeable.

So maybe I'm spoiled, as I've been reading ebooks for years on PDAs, but the thing is I don't know if I can get past this point.


I've also been reading books on PDAs for years, and was concerned about the screen refresh. I can honestly say that within a day I didn't even think about it anymore.

Having upgraded to the newest firmware, I find the page turns to be even faster than before, so for me speed isn't an issue. That said, I do occasionally still find the flash bothersome. I must be more sensitive than some here -- usually when I get to that point I just put the device away. I've tried the nonflash mode, but then the ghosting bugs me. :smack:

I think the bulk of the major complaints involving the flashing were from internet fanboys that had never even picked an eInk device up. That also seemed to have started the whole no backlite deal as well. I'm used to identifying it so it didn't even phase my decision to buy one.

I find that in blinking and refocusing back to the start of the page I take as much time as it takes to flash over. And after a few minutes to get your timing right it becomes unnoticable.

-MJ

The page turns faster than I can get another Doritos out of the bag :book2:

I find, just as I subconsciously prepare to turn the page as I'm coming to the bottom of it in a paper book, I've started pressing the page-turn button on my Cybook as I'm reading the last line or two. And, in my experience (which seems not uncommon), my mind has adapted to flash of the screen exactly the same way as it has to the visual disruption of a physical leaf of paper moving across the reading surface of a book.

(That said, occasionally do I snap out of the experience and look for pixels, but generally the net result of the disruption is a positive, pleasing frisson at the reminder that I've got an omnibook full of magical changing paper in my hands.)

Most e-ink paper has a refresh rate of ~790ms in grayscale mode, which almost all ebook devices use. However, there is a 2nd mode, called 1bit mode, which has a refresh rate of ~260ms, I do not know how to access this mode, I just know its available. I am wondering what ebooks would look like in 1 bit mode, if they would have jaggies or not.

Most e-ink paper has a refresh rate of ~790ms in grayscale mode, which almost all ebook devices use. However, there is a 2nd mode, called 1bit mode, which has a refresh rate of ~260ms, I do not know how to access this mode, I just know its available. I am wondering what ebooks would look like in 1 bit mode, if they would have jaggies or not.

They would have jaggies-- 1bit mode means each pixel is either on or off-- and anti-aliasing works by fooling the eye with shades of gray. Since you're turning off all the in-between shades they would jump out at you if you're the kind to notice them.

On the other hand, I stopped noticing the text and only ever see a black screen.

As I started this thread, I thought I'd weigh in my new opinion. After much research and research and going back to the borders store to play with the PRS-505 some more, I came to the conclusion it didn't really bother me.

Yeah its a little different at first. But I quickly got used it and have read 5 books now on my reader I just acquired last week.

I'm addicted. I haven't read this many books in years. :)

Bravo.

I'm addicted. I haven't read this many books in years. :)

That's the, 'Oh crap, I better actually read something to justify what I spent on this' phase. Just hope you keep it up afterwards.

-MJ

I'm w/ Danny, I hit the page turn button as I read the last couple of lines --- usually I time it so that I don't have to wait too long and it's pretty rare that it turns before I'm done reading, though it is awkward when reading aloud to my kids --- have to memorize a couple of words to keep from having a noticeable pause.

I really wish that there were an option to display in multiple columns like to Tofu.app for Mac OS X so that one could turn and read continuously.

William