Got a new 505 and noticed, after a week of steady use, the battery icon has reduced by one bar and wonder if I should recharge now or wait till it's more depleted.

Seem to recall that rechargeable batteries can develop a memory and that it's a good practice to let them drain way down before recharging them. Don't know if this is the case with the 505 and this technology or not.

Anybody have problems with this?

The 505 (and 500 for that matter) uses a LIon battery, they aren't susceptible to memory effects like the old-fashioned NiCd ones were. You're not likely to harm it by charging at 3 bars. Typically, I charge mine (500) when it gets down to 1 bar, but that's mostly because I don't care to charge it every week. :grin:

One thing to keep in mind is that rechargeable batteries have a fixed number of times they can be recharged. That isn't the total number of full recharges, it's the number of times you put it on the recharger, period. So recharging when 1 bar down uses up one of those recharges just as much as waiting until 3 bars are gone does.

That's one factor that manufacturers of these devices don't always make public. Some such batteries can be recharged 300 times, some 1000 times, some 800 times. Sometimes manufacturers will make it known, such as Canon did with the battery I have in my new point-and-shoot camera. It'll recharge 300 times, so I certainly won't be recharging it every day!

So if you can recharge the Sony Reader once a month or so, you'll get many years out of it before the battery won't accept a charge any more. If you recharge it once a week, you'll reduce that number of years by a factor of 4.

Since I haven't seen any longevity numbers on the Sony Reader battery, I'm working hard to recharge only once a month. Of course, whenever you attach it to a computer to delete books or load some more books, it uses up a recharge cycle and you can't do anything about it.

Which is another argument in favor of keeping a large number of books on the reader, to reduce the number of times you attach it to a computer via USB cable. Also it is in favor of using a memory card and simply copying files using a card reader/writer.

One thing to keep in mind is that rechargeable batteries have a fixed number of times they can be recharged. That isn't the total number of full recharges, it's the number of times you put it on the recharger, period. So recharging when 1 bar down uses up one of those recharges just as much as waiting until 3 bars are gone does.

That's one factor that manufacturers of these devices don't always make public. Some such batteries can be recharged 300 times, some 1000 times, some 800 times. Sometimes manufacturers will make it known, such as Canon did with the battery I have in my new point-and-shoot camera. It'll recharge 300 times, so I certainly won't be recharging it every day!

So if you can recharge the Sony Reader once a month or so, you'll get many years out of it before the battery won't accept a charge any more. If you recharge it once a week, you'll reduce that number of years by a factor of 4.

Since I haven't seen any longevity numbers on the Sony Reader battery, I'm working hard to recharge only once a month. Of course, whenever you attach it to a computer to delete books or load some more books, it uses up a recharge cycle and you can't do anything about it.

Which is another argument in favor of keeping a large number of books on the reader, to reduce the number of times you attach it to a computer via USB cable. Also it is in favor of using a memory card and simply copying files using a card reader/writer.

Sorry DHBaily, that is inaccurate. This may be helpful to know.

When they are talking about charge cycles, they are referring to charging from completely empty to full.

When you regularly charge from 2 or 3 bars, you are actually extending the battery life. For example, if I charge the battery 2 times from half empty, that counts as 1 charge cycle.

If I charge it from 3/4 full to full, 4 times, those 4 quarter charges equal 1 charge cycle. It is suggested to every once in awhile deplete the battery completely and charge from empty to refresh the battery meters.

I learned this from researching around the internet about my first iPod's battery. With that Class Action Lawsuit against Apple, they had articles and websites about LIon batterys all over the place.

battery of my prs-505 has only 6 days of life :( .... and i'm from europe... bad luck.

Li-ion is not supposed to have any memory (unlike NiCd and NiMH). I had read a while ago that Li-ion batteries, unlike NiMH, are best cared for by never letting them run down too far before recharging. Anyone know if that advice is still true?

Li-ion is not supposed to have any memory (unlike NiCd and NiMH). I had read a while ago that Li-ion batteries, unlike NiMH, are best cared for by never letting them run down too far before recharging. Anyone know if that advice is still true?

I believe that is correct. And to further extend the battery life, I read that you don't want to keep it in hot temperatures.

Sorry DHBaily, that is inaccurate. This may be helpful to know.

When they are talking about charge cycles, they are referring to charging from completely empty to full.

When you regularly charge from 2 or 3 bars, you are actually extending the battery life. For example, if I charge the battery 2 times from half empty, that counts as 1 charge cycle.

If I charge it from 3/4 full to full, 4 times, those 4 quarter charges equal 1 charge cycle. It is suggested to every once in awhile deplete the battery completely and charge from empty to refresh the battery meters.

I learned this from researching around the internet about my first iPod's battery. With that Class Action Lawsuit against Apple, they had articles and websites about LIon batterys all over the place.


Thanks for setting me straight -- there is still a finite number of recharge cycles but it's good to know that doing a partial charge isn't use a complete one of those cycles, so recharging one bar a week or once a month for all 4 bars makes no difference.

Now, has anybody read anywhere how many recharge cycles the Sony Reader battery can handle?

Not I, they're pretty closed mouthed about the battery. :shrug:

It's nice to have a reader with a user-replaceable battery :).

:nana:

:nana:

:laugh4: Totally zen like !

You noticed! :laughter:

Always do, you're pretty creative with those.:grin:

BTW I hate being watched.:o

Is being "beheld" any better? :D

I doubt that to be true but it's funnyer than the other.:grin:

Thanks for setting me straight -- there is still a finite number of recharge cycles but it's good to know that doing a partial charge isn't use a complete one of those cycles, so recharging one bar a week or once a month for all 4 bars makes no difference.

Now, has anybody read anywhere how many recharge cycles the Sony Reader battery can handle?

That's not perfectly accurate either. The number of charge cycles quoted by a manufacturer is really more about them trying to describe the complexities of how a battery ages to consumers without a deep technical background.

Lithium Ion batteries definitely age better with more frequent, shallow discharge/charge cycles vs. fewer complete discharge/charge cycles. For example, your Lithium Ion battery will be in better shape, with more capacity after 600 charges at two bars vs. 300 charges at 0 bars.

Nickel Cadmium batteries were just the opposite. Shallow discharges resulted in the memory effect, which could be reversed to some degree, but definitely left you with less capacity than full discharges did.

I miss NiCads. They would last forever when treated right and had great shelf life. LIons have great capacity/weight, but they literally start aging immediately after manufacture. You leave one on the shelf and it will die there. Independent of deep discharge into cell reversal.

Does anyone know if the extended Sony warranty covers replacing the battery?

P.S. Ooohhh I'm a Connoisseur :D

Does anyone know if the extended Sony warranty covers replacing the battery?

P.S. Ooohhh I'm a Connoisseur :D

Yes, I'm pretty sure it does, although they'll presumably have some guideline as to what level of reduction of capacity constitutes a "fault". A genuine battery fault, though - a complete inability to hold a charge - would certainly be fixed.

Yes, I'm pretty sure it does, although they'll presumably have some guideline as to what level of reduction of capacity constitutes a "fault". A genuine battery fault, though - a complete inability to hold a charge - would certainly be fixed.

Well I'm sure it'll be unacceptably low in 4 years of heavy use :D

You can be sure some of our more adventurous members will crack open our readers when the battery fades and attempt a replacement.

I well remember that there was a lot of silly fuss about iPod batteries a while ago. I remember wondering at the time why, if these people were so worried about battery replacements, they'd bought an iPod in the first place, knowing that it doesn't have a user-replaceable battery? Personally I've never owned a gadget like an iPod or an eBook reader long enough to worry about the LiIon battery dying :).

I well remember that there was a lot of silly fuss about iPod batteries a while ago. I remember wondering at the time why, if these people were so worried about battery replacements, they'd bought an iPod in the first place, knowing that it doesn't have a user-replaceable battery? Personally I've never owned a gadget like an iPod or an eBook reader long enough to worry about the LiIon battery dying :).
There is a good point against user replaceable batteries. The companies doing the service will be required to dispose of the dead batteries in a responsible fashion. That alone gets my thumbs up.

There are 2 different Capacity Cycles for the Sony PRS 505. One is with the Shut Down Enabled and the other with the Shut Down Disabled. One gets to Shut Down via the Settings in the Main Menu.

If Shut Down is Enabled less charge is used but it takes a little longer to boot up when the On/Off Switch is used.

So far with Shut Down Disabled I've had one 16 day cycle. I'm in my second cycle with the same setting now. The third cycle will be with Shut Down Enabled.

I do most of my reading on my PC using my 24" LCD Monitor. I just open the Reader to synchronize my bookmark in my current book. I only read via the Reader when baby sitting for my daughter and waiting in offices. I also read books on my PC using MS Reader. I alternate between MS Reader and Sony eBook Reader each day.

There is a good point against user replaceable batteries. The companies doing the service will be required to dispose of the dead batteries in a responsible fashion. That alone gets my thumbs up.

One would HOPE they would dispose of the dead batteries in a responsible fashion, but then one would have hoped that the chemical companies responsible for the Love Canal horror would have disposed of their chemicals responsibly.

There is nothing inherent in a battery replacement company which de facto guarantees that they will be environmentally safe in the handling of the dead batteries.

Most probably will, but some will just place them in their dumpsters along with their soda cans and lunch leftovers.

One would HOPE they would dispose of the dead batteries in a responsible fashion, but then one would have hoped that the chemical companies responsible for the Love Canal horror would have disposed of their chemicals responsibly.

There is nothing inherent in a battery replacement company which de facto guarantees that they will be environmentally safe in the handling of the dead batteries.

Most probably will, but some will just place them in their dumpsters along with their soda cans and lunch leftovers.
Apple already has a used laptop battery pickup program. Such a service is an OSHA controlled task. If I remember correctly, a good part of the batteries is recycled. As you say a concentration of the toxic substances in one spot is dangerous if left unprocessed for long periods. But compared to personnal ways of disposal, gathering up material for processing will be easyer, that is if not done immediately.

Love Canal was a heavy lesson. Most of the chemicals stored there still have no commercial use; they were byproducts. They could be destroyed but who'll fork the costs? Nuclear wastes face the same problems, most of them could be recycled up to 90% but no one wants to pay for it.

As you imply we rely on money obsessed entities to do the right thing. I still trust governmental agencies to force decency on companies more than the careless people around us.

SNIP
Love Canal was a heavy lesson. Most of the chemicals stored there still have no commercial use; they were byproducts. They could be destroyed but who'll fork the costs? Nuclear wastes face the same problems, most of them could be recycled up to 90% but no one wants to pay for it.

As you imply we rely on money obsessed entities to do the right thing. I still trust governmental agencies to force decency on companies more than the careless people around us.

I wrote a great big post responding to this, but the server seems to have chewed it up and spit it out. :smack: So, here goes for a 2nd try.

Going :offtopic: and ranting away!

Love Canal was indeed a heavy lesson. Big bad Hooker Chemical pollutes a neighborhood, causing all sorts of bad things to happen. And there was a grade-school there, and everything!

:smack: WRONG :smack:

Go read this article (http://www.reason.com/news/show/29319.html) and have your views of what happened turned upside down.

The short version is this: Hooker Chemical built a dump in the '40s that met the RCRA standards of the '80s. They transferred it to the Niagara Falls School Board under protest (due to threat of eminent domain), making absolutely certain that the school board was aware that the land was a chemical dump and was not suitable for any construction of any kind.

When the school board decided to put their school on top of the dump instead of next to it, Hooker Chemical went back and argued with them. Hooker took out ads in the local paper about what a bad idea it was! When the school board wanted to sell parts of the land to be developed into a subdivision, Hooker went back again reminding them that they really didn't want to breach the clay containment of the chemicals.

But the school board broke the clay containment building a school. And scraped off 1000s of cubic yards from the top of the dump to use elsewhere as fill. And the city put a storm drain and a sewer line through the dump. And the NY State DoT put a bleeping road foundation right through it, breaching the clay containment yet again!

Go read the article. Just about everything you thought you knew about Love Canal turns out to be wrong. :smack:

End of :offtopic: rant. We now return to your usual ebook related discussion...

Xenophon

I wrote a great big post responding to this, but the server seems to have chewed it up and spit it out. :smack: So, here goes for a 2nd try.


XenophonThanks for the link. Quite a heavy read there.

I've had a few chewed up letters before I found out to chek the little "save password box" when logging on . Was that it for you?

Nice post, Xenophon ... funny how the old lies live on. You have to debunk them on a regular basis. Reason has had some great rebuttals to commonly accepted myths, over the years. Sort of sad how certain lies self perpetuate, and in the Youtube world, it's not getting better ... any paranoid drivel can get a 4 star rating, while the well-reasoned answer disappears in obscurity, either because it isn't as polished, or because the truth often isn't all that entertaining.
Mike

On the other hand, it's hard to blame people for quoting some of these things, since it'd be a full time job to sort thru all the misinformation out there. You have to pick and choose where to devote yourtime. Another example that makes me laugh ... Al Gore claimed responsibility for looking into "Love Canal". Not true ... pretty much a case of bad journalism, that has had amazing legs, even after it got corrected. I'm not fond of Gore, but he was the victim, in this case.
Mike