Eagerly awaiting the proper review, Derek. It's a little past "Friday or Monday"...

<Tapping foot impatiently.... :) >

Ah, but he didn't say which Friday or Monday. ;)

And there is going to be new beta firmware for the Cybook soon as well. 0.91 is in it now and I think I read 0.96 is next. Makes no sence to write a review based on soon to be replaced firmware.

Makes no sence to write a review based on soon to be replaced firmware.

It is always easy to spot someone who doesn't have an Iliad...:D
yes, yes I know, but I couldn't resist, sorry JsWolf. :)

I thought it was funny, High 5. :grin:

It is always easy to spot someone who doesn't have an Iliad...:D

Very true! Bored with your iLiad? Wait a month or two and it'll be able to do something else. :D

Heh, with you around, Adam B., it's more like "wait ten minutes ...." :grin:

I so wanted to ask that question at 12:01am on Tuesday, but the rational part of me prevented that. Hopefully he'll get it up as soon as he can.

Guys, guys, guys... :smack:

Yep. It's official! I'll be getting the *next* update early (probably Monday) next week. And it's going to be sufficiently updated that I'd rather wait until I get it installed. What I'll be able to do with the updated software versus what the current Cybook software can do - well, let's just say that it wouldn't be fair to do a review at this point.

Remember, I'm running on *BETA* release software here. That means I've had the occasion to find out just what 'bricking' really means. (I have yet to modify the software in my Sony PRS-500 so I've not had the joy of 'bricking', locking up my Sony as of yet.) Right now, I'm letting my Cybook recharge as I actually managed to drain the battery! And, once it got *enough* juice, it came back to life quite well! Oh, the joys of being a beta-tester!:grin2:

Still, all in all, I have to say that the Cybook is quite the match for the PRS-500. Will the PRS-505 be sufficiently better? Given the overall performance of the *BETA* version of the Cybook as compared to the Sony, the 505 is going to have to have 'knock-your-socks-off' features to impress me.

One thing I do like, even at this stage in software development, is that I'm not constrained by the need for CONNECT software on my PC. Nope. Just plug the USB cable into both, open the Cybook as a removeable drive and move the files where I want. I'd love to be able to connect in via Bluetooth or WiFi, but I can live with USB. No need to install and maintain custom software!

Derek

I so wanted to ask that question at 12:01am on Tuesday, but the rational part of me prevented that. Hopefully he'll get it up as soon as he can.

And there is going to be new beta firmware for the Cybook soon as well. 0.91 is in it now and I think I read 0.96 is next. Makes no sence to write a review based on soon to be replaced firmware.
And after the 0.96 update there will likely be a 1.0 release- doesn't make sense to review beta software when the full 1.0 release is just around the corner. But, oh wait, there will be some bugs fixed in the 1.05 release- maybe we should wait for that.... :p

It's not like he hasn't posted any info. We've got pics and everything (even if I, personally, could have skipped seeing one of them.) Both here at MR and on his blog.

It's not like he hasn't posted any info. We've got pics and everything (even if I, personally, could have skipped seeing one of them.) Both here at MR and on his blog.
Yes but in the first set of pictures the screen looks grey- like the Sony. In the second set it looks much whiter- like paper. Which is it? Also even with beta software we can still get some answers to what differentiates the Cybook from the Sony, and how much better the vizplex is over the last generation e-ink screens- Ghosting and contrast. Also more details on fonts, button placement and navigation, user interface- how the unit feels in the hand- how much lighter is it, etc.

There will always be improvements in software (hopefully), but that doesn't mean we can't get at least some sort of review of what they have now.

Ravenflight,

Part of the problem is that my display racks (I'm using some designed for small collectible plates.) and my compact fluourescent photofloods (Daylight balanced) haven't arrived yet. So even though the light-tent I have is large enough to accommodate the Sony PRS-500, the Bookeen Cybook Gen3 *AND* a Dell Axim x51v side-by-side, I don't have everything I need to get consistently reproducible lighting for the review photos. That means the images I shot of the graphics novel pages were taken with my 14-45 zoom and the itsy-bitsy pop-up flash on my Olympus Evolt E-300 - and believe you me, that is one TINY flash! Other than a quick High-pass filter to sharpen the overall image, I did no contrast or exposure adjustment to it. I'd have used the flash for the first of the Sony-Cybook side-bys but I couldn't get the glare out.

My bad. But I'm shooting the next batch using a new Canon EOS 400D (Digital Rebel XTi, 10.1 megapixel) and the photofloods will arrive by Friday. Hooray! Consistent, soft, broad lighting!

I promise the lighting will be much better.

Derek

Yes but in the first set of pictures the screen looks grey- like the Sony. In the second set it looks much whiter- like paper. Which is it? Also even with beta software we can still get some answers to what differentiates the Cybook from the Sony, and how much better the vizplex is over the last generation e-ink screens- Ghosting and contrast. Also more details on fonts, button placement and navigation, user interface- how the unit feels in the hand- how much lighter is it, etc.

There will always be improvements in software (hopefully), but that doesn't mean we can't get at least some sort of review of what they have now.

Wow, someone's got some spare change. :)

Don't put yourself into the poorhouse for us Derek.

Wow, someone's got some spare change. :)

Don't put yourself into the poorhouse for us Derek.
When he's done using all this equipment for shooting eink devices, he's going to use it for his porn business.

;)

MikeF74,

Well, living as *I* do on a fixed Social Security Disability income, I'm sure that I will get plenty of people who are willing to donate to my personal Paypal account - found at my blog: Derek's Blog Page (http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/). All this lighting equipment and other stuff has run to over $150! Remember, this is *MY* equipment, not NAEB's! Every bit helps if anyone wants to donate. :pray:

Derek
Wow, someone's got some spare change. :)

Don't put yourself into the poorhouse for us Derek.

JSWolf...

Oh don't I *WISH*! Hell, I'd settle for running an eBay product photo service, but the CC&Rs in our neighborhood are *VERY* tight! Not that my mother would allow this in her home.:disappoin

:smack:

Derek

When he's done using all this equipment for shooting eink devices, he's going to use it for his porn business.

;)

JSWolf...

Oh don't I *WISH*! Hell, I'd settle for running an eBay product photo service, but the CC&Rs in our neighborhood are *VERY* tight! Not that my mother would allow this in her home.:disappoin

:smack:

Derek
Well you know some people do have a fetish for older ladies.

When he's done using all this equipment for shooting eink devices, he's going to use it for his porn business.

;)
LOL! At least he might be able to recoup his expenses that way! :p
Seriously Derek- Don't mortgage your house just for the review! I didn't mean what I said as any kind of criticism- I know how difficult it is to take photos, and still get the colors to match reality. A text review of your thoughts and opinions on the Cybook is all I was hoping for. (For Neko's sake you might want to censor your comics- for me it just emphasizes the need for color e-ink displays!) :D

Oh come now! Nekokami's just gonna have to suck it up and grow a big, hairy pair - or a solid brass pair. :grin2: By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)

Yeah, I *could* just do a text review, but it doesn't feel right considering the changes that are coming this next week.

And if I had to mortgage my (well, Mom's) house, I'd be just like all the others out here with that sinking feeling of rejection by the mortgate industry! :D :D :D

Derek

LOL! At least he might be able to recoup his expenses that way! :p
Seriously Derek- Don't mortgage your house just for the review! I didn't mean what I said as any kind of criticism- I know how difficult it is to take photos, and still get the colors to match reality. A text review of your thoughts and opinions on the Cybook is all I was hoping for. (For Neko's sake you might want to censor your comics- for me it just emphasizes the need for color e-ink displays!) :D

Oh come now! Nekokami's just gonna have to suck it up and grow a big, hairy pair - or a solid brass pair. :grin2: By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)You have to keep in mind though that this will be the first real review for this device... It will probably get linked to by Engadget and many people will be looking at it from work.

By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)
Sorry, I will need visual confirmation of this statement- if you will provide me with some links to some examples I will gladly check them out- only in the interest of verification you understand. :p

And if I had to mortgage my (well, Mom's) house, I'd be just like all the others out here with that sinking feeling of rejection by the mortgate industry!
Trust me, I have several of those mortgages and you are not missing anything- except maybe that empty feeling you get when you see a negative symbol before your checking account balance! Watch out for those mortgage brokers. :deal:

Oh come now! Nekokami's just gonna have to suck it up and grow a big, hairy pair - or a solid brass pair. :grin2: By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)
Thank you so much for your charming consideration.

Oh come now! Nekokami's just gonna have to suck it up and grow a big, hairy pair - or a solid brass pair. :grin2: By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)

Derek

It was mild and not something that offends me personally but I'm at work. I didn't appreciate that much either.

I just didn't pay attention to the anime. I think Menga is crap. It's bad enough when it's animated. But in B/W on a low res device. Bah!

Sure. I can understand. Of course, once I'm ready to post a review, I'll probably post it at our (NAEB's) website and as a separate column at my blog. As well as here. :D

Derek

You have to keep in mind though that this will be the first real review for this device... It will probably get linked to by Engadget and many people will be looking at it from work.

Neko,

I apologize if I offended you. I was just making a joke. I don't really think that. :smack:

Derek

Thank you so much for your charming consideration.

JSWolf,

Which is why the sample Manga images they included on the engineering sample seemed so... weird! And not what I regularly read - or a good example of graphics on the Cybook.

Derek

I just didn't pay attention to the anime. I think Menga is crap. It's bad enough when it's animated. But in B/W on a low res device. Bah!

Sure. I can understand. Of course, once I'm ready to post a review, I'll probably post it at our (NAEB's) website and as a separate column at my blog. As well as here.I don't think you fully understood what I was getting at Derek. I wasn't talking bandwith issues...

What I am saying is the display of cartoon breasts on a computer screen at work is enough to get some people reprimanded or fired. Sad, but true. So I'm just saying that you may want to lay of NSFW material in your full review.

What I am saying is the display of cartoon breasts on a computer screen at work is enough to get some people reprimanded or fired. Sad, but true.
Yes this is very true at my work. All internet usage is monitored- in fact all computer use of any kind is monitored- They track every page you go to- and you'd better be prepared to explain how such usage was company related if you ever have the misfortune to be summoned before the inquisition. Corporate Security lives by the motto 'Guilty until proven innocent.'

By the standards of most anime/manga I've seen floating around the internet, that picture was *MILD*! :)I work for the state of Texas, and that sort of thing is one of the very few that can get me into serious trouble at work. :zoiks:

Besides, we do try to keep it family friendly around here, so if you happen to have anther pic that might illustrate the same thing (and I don't mean the things in the illustration :wink:), but stays on the lighter side of PG-13, it might be appreciated (evidently by several of us) if you wouldn't mind switching it out yourself. :shrug:

Mike,

Where did you get the idea that I didn't understand you? Did you not read my apology to Nekokami?

Derek

I don't think you fully understood what I was getting at Derek. I wasn't talking bandwith issues...

What I am saying is the display of cartoon breasts on a computer screen at work is enough to get some people reprimanded or fired. Sad, but true. So I'm just saying that you may want to lay of NSFW material in your full review.

No worse than living in America. Let's see, I routinely have email conversations with people in France, UK, Germany, Israel, South Korea, China *and* Taiwan as well as even a few people in Turkey and South Africa. Not to mention my family friends in Kenya. What with all I've written to those people - even though the words would *have* to be taken out of context - I'm sure my email and phones are routinely monitored by DHS. Heck, I have received email from Iraqis.

IOW, it's not as if I have any reasonable expectation of privacy in my own life. So - in *my* life - I don't even flinch at NSFW. But I have already deleted that image from my blog and have no intention of including it in the reviews as after Nekokami pointed it out, I realized many others *are* worried about corporate 'guardians'. (Strange how knowing DHS is watching just makes the corp types so trivial to me. Sorry guys and gals.)

Derek

Yes this is very true at my work. All internet usage is monitored- in fact all computer use of any kind is monitored- They track every page you go to- and you'd better be prepared to explain how such usage was company related if you ever have the misfortune to be summoned before the inquisition. Corporate Security lives by the motto 'Guilty until proven innocent.'

Well, don't worry about me- I do all my browsing at work now on my personal iPhone- Now if they want to look over my shoulder, they have to literally look over my shoulder! And I can see em coming a long way off. :nana:
Best 20.00 a month I ever spent!

Isn't iPhone service, like, a *minimum* of $60 per month? :blink:

Derek

Well, don't worry about me- I do all my browsing at work now on my personal iPhone- Now if they want to look over my shoulder, they have to literally look over my shoulder! And I can see em coming a long way off. :nana:
Best 20.00 a month I ever spent!

Strange how the culture is different between the US and Europe, here
in France nobody would accept to have his internet browsing tracked
when at work!

Liberty, oh, dear liberty...

Strange how the culture is different between the US and Europe, here
in France nobody would accept to have his internet browsing tracked
when at work!

Liberty, oh, dear liberty...

I'm Italian and - although I often joke with american friends about how fast they're running towards a police state - I am pretty sure that today nowhere is safe from electronic monitoring (e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON )

alessandro

Isn't iPhone service, like, a *minimum* of $60 per month? :blink:

Derek

The iPhone is being launched here in the UK this month, and the minimum contract price is £35 - US$70 - per month, although that includes unlimited data traffic. It's not even 3G either, unlike most "hi tech" phones now sold in Europe. I really don't see why anyone would want one, I have to admit!

I know at least one college in the UK were they monitor the Internet usage by the staff. They even have a list which has all college staff on it and how much they are using the Internet to browse for non college related content. If a tutor gets into top 50, it is not a good sign...

So, I guess they are going to adopt the same draconian rules as in the USA. (as the saying goes: whatever happens in the USA will be adopted here in 10 years)

Isn't iPhone service, like, a *minimum* of $60 per month? :blink:

Derek
Not when you are already a subscriber- If you are just adding the iPhone data plan to an existing account it is an extra 20.00 a month over what you are currently paying for whatever talk plan you are on.

Does the US have "3G" phone networks, as a matter of interest? I'm rather curious as to why Apple went for EDGE for the iPhone rather than the vastly faster 3G.

Does the US have "3G" phone networks, as a matter of interest? I'm rather curious as to why Apple went for EDGE for the iPhone rather than the vastly faster 3G.

Yes, we do. These guys (http://www.helio.com/#homepage), for example, are 3G-based. I think Verizon has 3G deployed to support their new cell phone television service, but I could be wrong.

Does the US have "3G" phone networks, as a matter of interest? I'm rather curious as to why Apple went for EDGE for the iPhone rather than the vastly faster 3G.

Yes, the US has 3G. FWIW, the official line I've read about why Apple chose not to go with it is that they were concerned about battery life, and the current 3G chipsets consume somewhat more power than 2.5G.

I wonder if it's a matter of coverage as well? It's obviously far easier to have a 3G network which covers a small, densely populated country like the UK than a huge, sparsely populated one like the US. I wonder if perhaps more of the country is covered by EDGE than by 3G?

I wonder if it's a matter of coverage as well? It's obviously far easier to have a 3G network which covers a small, densely populated country like the UK than a huge, sparsely populated one like the US. I wonder if perhaps more of the country is covered by EDGE than by 3G?
I don't know about other wireless companies, but AT&T has fairly complete EDGE coverage in the US, but their 3G coverage is quite spotty.

When I used to visit the US 10 years ago, my multiband (British) GSM phone would only work in big US cities - go anywhere rural and there was no coverage. Today I can go practically anywhere in the US and it works fine. There seems to have been a massive expansion in GSM coverage in that time period.

Waitaminit!!! You have to wait *TEN YEARS*!!! :freak: How come you all are so behind the times!!! :huh: C'mon, buttonhole your politicians and *demand* they get with the Global War on Terror, right now!!! :smash:

:D:D:D

Just kidding. :)

Derek

I know at least one college in the UK were they monitor the Internet usage by the staff. They even have a list which has all college staff on it and how much they are using the Internet to browse for non college related content. If a tutor gets into top 50, it is not a good sign...

So, I guess they are going to adopt the same draconian rules as in the USA. (as the saying goes: whatever happens in the USA will be adopted here in 10 years)

Ok, now he's just taunting us! :)

http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/2007/09/back-to-my-photography-temporarily.html

MikeF,

I wouldn't do that, would I?:rolleyes:

Nope, it's just that I like photography as much as I like reading. :)

I think I'll just go back and hammer out a few more Cybook observations if you all aren't gonna appreciate me! :smash:

:D:D:D

Derek

Ok, now he's just taunting us! :)

http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/2007/09/back-to-my-photography-temporarily.html

Michael from Bookeen just posted to the French discussion.

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showpost.php?p=99031&postcount=47

From what I could gather, through an iffy Google translation, is that they too are anxiously awaiting Derek's review. It also seems like he wants to hand out a few devices for either an open beta, or for community review. Or maybe it is a hands on meet and greet with photos allowed. Its hard to get at exactly what he is saying using a computer translation.

Anybody conversant in French who can help out?

I've created a 'sample' mobi file using BookDesigner of my (uncompleted) 2006 NaNoWriMo entry (I finished 50K words.) and the preliminary cover for it. I've also created a Sony LRF version of it for my PRS-500 and as soon as my new camera body arrives (hopefully today), I'll be taking pictures of the two devices. (Yes, I got the lights, the light-tent, the display racks and the backdrops, so I'm good to go once the camera arrives!)

Anyway, here are the two sample files I'll be using.

Bookeen is proposing to all people interested in the Cybook Gen3 to meet them and test the reader before the official launch.

Nice :-)

:dtw:

Not so nice. They have no presence in Boston.

Bookeen is proposing to all people interested in the Cybook Gen3 to meet them and test the reader before the official launch.:

Sigh...Yep and I am having a party this evening and guess what...You are all invited!
I'd be hapier with them posting a nice long .avi of a Cybook III in all kinds of action.

I don't have everything I need to get consistently reproducible lighting for the review photos.

Just one silly suggestion, since getting everything to turn out identical appears to be an issue. Why not use a point of reference? Like say a sheet of paper with a good reference # as a backdrop for each device. #96 brightness paper is something we can probably all get our hands on and if its in every shot we can arguable take the pictures and decide for ourselves how well each compares?

Rather than spending a few grand on equipment a pennies worth of paper may be adequate?

Great! Without a stable light source - window light won't cut it because it varies throughout the day - the quantity affects how big an aperture my camera uses, which means differences in depth of field - as well as the fact that my *ON-CAMERA* flash causes horrendous glare in all but the most awkward positions. Thanks, but no thanks. I've spent $200 for my lighting and I'm happy with it. As for the new camera body, well, I had saved my pennies to get one anyway. I'll be able to use it for other pictures.

Derek

Just one silly suggestion, since getting everything to turn out identical appears to be an issue. Why not use a point of reference? Like say a sheet of paper with a good reference # as a backdrop for each device. #96 brightness paper is something we can probably all get our hands on and if its in every shot we can arguable take the pictures and decide for ourselves how well each compares?

Rather than spending a few grand on equipment a pennies worth of paper may be adequate?

Well I did say it was a silly suggestion Derek! Seriously though the point of reference wasnt that bad of an idea sheesh! :)

And I thank you from the bottom of my wallet. :D

Yes, I will be using a 'point-of-reference' to set the white-balance on my camera for the photos.

Derek

Well I did say it was a silly suggestion Derek! Seriously though the point of reference wasnt that bad of an idea sheesh! :)

I've now had the Cybook Gen3 for just one week. And I'm beginning to like it. Notice I said 'beginning'. I've owned a Sony PRS-500 for over a month now and for the first few days the Cybook was here, I didn't really care for it.

Don't get me wrong, the new Visplex eInk display is, to my eye, much sharper and noticeably more contrasty than the older eInk display found on the PRS-500. But Sony's device seemed somehow... more polished... more finished.

And it finally 'clicked' in my mind what the problem was with the Cybook. It's too danged LIGHT! That's right, my PRS-500 is heavier than the Cybook and even more so when I put the PRS-500 into it's softcover case. And, subconsciously, I felt the Cybook was 'flimsier' than the PRS-500 as a result.

So what happened to change my mind? I dropped the Cybook. I was attempting to pull it out of the cargo pocket in my trousers when I bumped my arm and let go. It promptly fell three feet to the hard, linoleum floor in the kitchen. The Cybook was on at the time - I'm tending to just leave it on during the day - and my first thought was "Ohmygod! I broke it!". Then I flipped it over so I could see the screen and there was my ebook, right at the page I left it. Still, I couldn't help wondering if maybe it had frozen there upon impact. Crossing my fingers, I paged forward. It changed to the next page! I called up the contextual menu and returned to the Library, and it did as I commanded! Finally, taking a deep, deep breath, I turned it off and then, after waiting a minute, turned it back on...

Hooray! It came right back up! This happened two days ago and I've been using it ever since.

Now I wouldn't recommend anyone go around dropping a $300+ ebook reader, but I'm now completely satisfied with the hardware.

As for the software, I like what I can do, but I must point out that I can't really do as much as I want to because I don't have the most recent firmware updates. Those come this next week. Considering what will be added by then, I don't believe it would be fair to Bookeen for me to make serious criticisms of what is, essentially, 'beta' software.

Still, there are some things I'd like to see in upcoming updates.

1. ability to use the SD card - this has been promised soon.
2. ability to open pdb files - should be working soon.
3. ability to 'Go To' a specific page - or First and Last - promised soon.
4. softcover - we'll have it when it's ready, but I worry about scratching the display - and as clumsy as I am, dropping it again.
5. some sort of user's manual.
6. a better way to group ebooks, say into folders. I believe work is being done on this.
7. support for FBReader ebook files. Again, I believe this is being worked on.
8. support for PDF. (Okay, maybe not. I find it's not all that difficult for me to use Adobe Acrobat Pro to extract everything and re-format into Mobipocket.)
9. battery-level indicator inside the ebooks!!! This is a must-have!
10. removable/modifyable headers and footers. Coming, just not in my beta release.
11. toolkit CD which contains the latest version of BookDesigner and an instruction guide for using it to port over to Mobipocket. This is, IMO, another must-have! Many people are going to buy these who don't already know about BD or where to get it and they aren't going to be all that interested in going through forum support groups to find copies. I'm sure there will be other goodies which can be tossed onto the CD as well.
12. let's just leave it at that, because I'm sure the list will change, shrink or maybe grow, after the next firmware update.

Still, I'm finding that I like the Cybook.

I have mastered BookDesigner to the point where I can make a pretty good conversion of text, html and rtf ebooks into the Mobipocket format. And I've found that the Mobipocket format versions of Baen's Webscriptions ebooks work great on the Cybook. I haven't yet purchased an ebook in Mobipocket format from either Mobipocket or Fictionwise. I'm about to do so. I'll tell you how it went, later.

Great! Without a stable light source - window light won't cut it because it varies throughout the day - the quantity affects how big an aperture my camera uses, which means differences in depth of field - as well as the fact that my *ON-CAMERA* flash causes horrendous glare in all but the most awkward positions. Thanks, but no thanks. I've spent $200 for my lighting and I'm happy with it. As for the new camera body, well, I had saved my pennies to get one anyway. I'll be able to use it for other pictures.

Derek
I recently purchased a Fuji SD700 (I think that's the model). I'll just take a few photos of my Sony with natural light and see what happens.

Watch I find out I don't need fancy lighting.

I've created a 'sample' mobi file using BookDesigner This may be about as good as can be done with BookDesigner, but, like most of the .prc books posted here, it isn't optimal because it does not have a MobiPocket TOC. Instead it has an in-line TOC as HTML links. This may work almost as well in practice on devices with little support for the MobiPocket format, but there is a difference. A good example of a professional .prc file is Ring of Fire (http://www.webscription.net/p-352-ring-of-fire.aspx). Baen does not supply a .lrf version but perhaps the .rtf version wil work on the Sony (and the Cybook for that matter).

Wallcraft,

Ummm... Have you *TRIED* to use Mobipocket Creator's ToC wizard? Because if you haven't, you can't help me. I'd *LOVE* to have an HTML file all decked out with a proper Mobi ToC, or even better, a *CLEAR*, *IN-DEPTH* tutorial written that even a *DUMMY* like me could comprehend!

Until then, having the .rtf or plain-jane .html files aren't going to do me squat. 'Cause I already *GOT* plenty of those. And until then, I'm going to use BD for my personal Mobi work.

Derek
This may be about as good as can be done with BookDesigner, but, like most of the .prc books posted here, it isn't optimal because it does not have a MobiPocket TOC. Instead it has an in-line TOC as HTML links. This may work almost as well in practice on devices with little support for the MobiPocket format, but there is a difference. A good example of a professional .prc file is Ring of Fire (http://www.webscription.net/p-352-ring-of-fire.aspx). Baen does not supply a .lrf version but perhaps the .rtf version wil work on the Sony (and the Cybook for that matter).

A P.S. to this post.

I'm not going to pull punches here just because I'm part of NAEB. I'm still gathering my thoughts and I'll have a complete review next week. This upcoming review will be a fair evaluation of the Cybook Gen3, not a glossed-over press release.

I expect many of the software complaints I've expressed here will go away in upcoming firmware updates. If they don't, I'll mention them again if I think they're critical.

Derek

I've now had the Cybook Gen3 for just one week. And I'm beginning to like it. Notice I said 'beginning'. I've owned a Sony PRS-500 for over a month now and for the first few days the Cybook was here, I didn't really care for it.

Don't get me wrong, the new Visplex eInk display is, to my eye, much sharper and noticeably more contrasty than the older eInk display found on the PRS-500. But Sony's device seemed somehow... more polished... more finished.

And it finally 'clicked' in my mind what the problem was with the Cybook. It's too danged LIGHT! That's right, my PRS-500 is heavier than the Cybook and even more so when I put the PRS-500 into it's softcover case. And, subconsciously, I felt the Cybook was 'flimsier' than the PRS-500 as a result.

So what happened to change my mind? I dropped the Cybook. I was attempting to pull it out of the cargo pocket in my trousers when I bumped my arm and let go. It promptly fell three feet to the hard, linoleum floor in the kitchen. The Cybook was on at the time - I'm tending to just leave it on during the day - and my first thought was "Ohmygod! I broke it!". Then I flipped it over so I could see the screen and there was my ebook, right at the page I left it. Still, I couldn't help wondering if maybe it had frozen there upon impact. Crossing my fingers, I paged forward. It changed to the next page! I called up the contextual menu and returned to the Library, and it did as I commanded! Finally, taking a deep, deep breath, I turned it off and then, after waiting a minute, turned it back on...

Hooray! It came right back up! This happened two days ago and I've been using it ever since.

Now I wouldn't recommend anyone go around dropping a $300+ ebook reader, but I'm now completely satisfied with the hardware.

As for the software, I like what I can do, but I must point out that I can't really do as much as I want to because I don't have the most recent firmware updates. Those come this next week. Considering what will be added by then, I don't believe it would be fair to Bookeen for me to make serious criticisms of what is, essentially, 'beta' software.

Still, there are some things I'd like to see in upcoming updates.

1. ability to use the SD card - this has been promised soon.
2. ability to open pdb files - should be working soon.
3. ability to 'Go To' a specific page - or First and Last - promised soon.
4. softcover - we'll have it when it's ready, but I worry about scratching the display - and as clumsy as I am, dropping it again.
5. some sort of user's manual.
6. a better way to group ebooks, say into folders. I believe work is being done on this.
7. support for FBReader ebook files. Again, I believe this is being worked on.
8. support for PDF. (Okay, maybe not. I find it's not all that difficult for me to use Adobe Acrobat Pro to extract everything and re-format into Mobipocket.)
9. battery-level indicator inside the ebooks!!! This is a must-have!
10. removable/modifyable headers and footers. Coming, just not in my beta release.
11. toolkit CD which contains the latest version of BookDesigner and an instruction guide for using it to port over to Mobipocket. This is, IMO, another must-have! Many people are going to buy these who don't already know about BD or where to get it and they aren't going to be all that interested in going through forum support groups to find copies. I'm sure there will be other goodies which can be tossed onto the CD as well.
12. let's just leave it at that, because I'm sure the list will change, shrink or maybe grow, after the next firmware update.

Still, I'm finding that I like the Cybook.

I have mastered BookDesigner to the point where I can make a pretty good conversion of text, html and rtf ebooks into the Mobipocket format. And I've found that the Mobipocket format versions of Baen's Webscriptions ebooks work great on the Cybook. I haven't yet purchased an ebook in Mobipocket format from either Mobipocket or Fictionwise. I'm about to do so. I'll tell you how it went, later.

2. ability to open pdb files - should be working soon.

Woo-hoo! :yahoo: :rohard: :beer:


:pray:

Do you know what "type" of PDB will be supported? As you know, PDB is just a "container" which can hold any type of file at all! I'd guess "PalmDoc" at least. Anything else?

HarryT,

I've been using eReader's version of Palm Ebook Studio for some time now - and I've recently used BD to create both Palm Reader and Palm Reader Pro files - all of which my Dell Axim opens up and reads just fine. As soon as they get it fully up and running on the Cybook, I'll run .PDBs from both applications through and tell you more. Obviously, unless and until Bookeen makes a deal with eReader, the secure versions will not be accessible.

Derek

Do you know what "type" of PDB will be supported? As you know, PDB is just a "container" which can hold any type of file at all! I'd guess "PalmDoc" at least. Anything else?

Thanks - I'll be interested to hear.

Sounds like an awfully lot of "soon"s

And it is...

Look, as I've pointed out over the last week, the engineering sample I received had version 0.91 beta while, even at the time I got it in the mail, Bookeen was using version 0.96. And that difference counts. For example, I will be able to actually *USE* the SD card slot with v0.96! Right now I *must* hook up the Cybook to get my ebooks onto it.

Also, under v0.91, and possibly even under 0.96 - I won't know until I get it installed, they've broken down the My Documents directory with folders for Text, My eBooks, Htm and Html. I understand that with the release of the finished firmware, all the ebooks will be in the My eBooks folder.

I also believe that we will be able to upload our own font families, but I'm not sure about that. I do know that there are currently six (6) font families installed on the Cybook. Makes it nice to not have to re-format the ebook to the font I want and then re-install. :D

As I work for NAEB and not Bookeen, I don't have the full access to the development process and can't really say which feature is coming, coming soon or coming real soon. Sorry. :(

Derek

Sounds like an awfully lot of "soon"s

Why the hell did you receive v0.91 if they already had v0.96?

Guguy,

I don't know for sure, but I think they were shipped out to us before they updated. At least, that's what I'm assuming. It took a few days to get them from Europe to New York and over a week - delivery problems - to get my unit from New York to California. All in all, about a week-and-a-half of transit time to me and a week of ownership. Add that to the fact they're going gangbusters on development and that 2-and-1/2-weeks means a lot of things have changed. :smack:

Still, I expect we'll be getting firmware downloads of the latest by Monday or Tuesday of this week. :pray:

Derek

Why the hell did you receive v0.91 if they already had v0.96?

Weren't they able to email you the new firmware? :blink:

This may be about as good as can be done with BookDesigner, but, like most of the .prc books posted here, it isn't optimal because it does not have a MobiPocket TOC. Instead it has an in-line TOC as HTML links. This may work almost as well in practice on devices with little support for the MobiPocket format, but there is a difference. A good example of a professional .prc file is Ring of Fire (http://www.webscription.net/p-352-ring-of-fire.aspx). Baen does not supply a .lrf version but perhaps the .rtf version wil work on the Sony (and the Cybook for that matter).
I'm sorry, but Ring of Fire is not a good example. There is no proper cover image for one. That is a cover image for the ebooks shown in the bookshelf. And granted there is no link that says Table of Contents specifically. But other then that, the ebooks made with BD seem fine if there are no real images.

How about Boundary? I can download that in both mobipocket and rtf formats and then convert the rtf into lrf? It's got a nice cover on it and should show up well in Sony. And I've had no problem with creating cover images in BD. That way I'll be able to compare a BD directory with one created by BD. Suit everyone? Good.

Derek

I'm sorry, but Ring of Fire is not a good example. There is no proper cover image for one. That is a cover image for the ebooks shown in the bookshelf. And granted there is no link that says Table of Contents specifically. But other then that, the ebooks made with BD seem fine if there are no real images.

But if they are waiting on your review, you'd think they'd want you to have the latest firmware to do a proper review.

You did make it sound like the Cybook was actually more sturdy then the Sony when you mentioned the drop. Someone's Sony went flying pretty good (there's a forum post on it) and other then a few scratches, it works fine.

8. most people do not have Acrobat Pro. So how would you recommend getting PDF converted?

11. As for BD being included in a Toolkit CD, that would have to be agreed by vvv to allow that to happen. But, there is noting at all to stop Bookeen from linking to MobilRead and the appropriate forum threads to get it.

MobiPocket Designer (IMHO) is just clumsy. It's hard to use. Bookeen could do a nice manual for it so people can convert content using it if they want.

Well, life is like that sometimes. *I* would think so too, but I got 0.91.

And now that I think of it, I *do* remember the person who dropped their Sony - he did so *FIVE* feet onto concrete!!! And what I was trying to say was that my Cybook kept on working even though it feels lighter than the Sony PRS-500. And that until I dropped it, my subconscious was equating lighter with 'flimsier' - a point I stressed. Which is NOT the same as saying the Cybook is sturdier - just that my perception of 'flimsiness' was not warranted.

As for not having Acrobat Pro, well, I don't know what PDF-to-HTML tools there are out there. Something I'll have to research, yes :)

And you're right, if vvv doesn't want BD bundled into a Toolkit CD, I'm sure Bookeen can ask permission to link to the BD download page.

Your view agrees with mine on Mobipocket Creator. It sucks raw, rotten eggs for ease of use. I'm sure *someone* should create a solid user's guide or explicit and complete tutorial for it. Anyone want to volunteer? Anyone? Anyone? :D

Derek

But if they are waiting on your review, you'd think they'd want you to have the latest firmware to do a proper review.

You did make it sound like the Cybook was actually more sturdy then the Sony when you mentioned the drop. Someone's Sony went flying pretty good (there's a forum post on it) and other then a few scratches, it works fine.

8. most people do not have Acrobat Pro. So how would you recommend getting PDF converted?

11. As for BD being included in a Toolkit CD, that would have to be agreed by vvv to allow that to happen. But, there is noting at all to stop Bookeen from linking to MobilRead and the appropriate forum threads to get it.

MobiPocket Designer (IMHO) is just clumsy. It's hard to use. Bookeen could do a nice manual for it so people can convert content using it if they want.

Bookeen doesn't need to ask permission to link to the BD download page. All Bookeen needs do is link to the various forum threads on MobileRead including the one I made with the Installer and the updates.

@delphidb96

If you can, then please give me a link to the firmware update. I'm still considering giving it a go on my STAReBOOK. If it works then we'd know how closely the two devices are related. If it bricks the device...well...there are worse things that could happen...and since the STAReBOOK updates from SD card I should even be able to unbrick it that way if it's not too seriously damaged.

I'd take the cover off both first to see how similar the PCBs are.

Okay. Took my Sony PRS-500 and removed the softcover. Placed it on my handy-dandy, although hard-to-read analog, meal scale. It turned over at 8.75 ounces - roughly. Put the softcover back on and weighed it again -- 11.5 ounces.

Then I weighed the Cybook Gen3 - I don't have a softcover for it yet -- it turned in at a light 6.1 ounces. That's right in line with Bookeen's claim of 6.13 ounces given that my eyesight isn't that great and the scale only shows by 1/10 ounce increments.

So there's verifiable proof the Cybook is lighter than the PRS-500. And 33% less weight (2+ ounces) was enough to give the impression of flimsy, which I'm now saying it doesn't deserve.

Derek

Are you planning any side-by-side videos showing simultaneous page turns with the same document (or documents of similar complexity)? I think that would be interesting to see.

So it would. And, of course, everyone bitches because I spend money to get decent images and then ask for donations to help out. The reason I mention the latter is because to do videos, I'll need to buy *some* sort of video-capable camera - even if it's one of those USB wonders for YouTube production. Nope, you heard it here first, Derek Benner, the photo geek has only *STILL* cameras!!! :smack:

Derek

Are you planning any side-by-side videos showing simultaneous page turns with the same document (or documents of similar complexity)? I think that would be interesting to see.

Really? None of your still digital cameras have a video mode? Oh well.

Really? None of your still digital cameras have a video mode? Oh well.
My Fuji SD700 has a video mode. So I think maybe I should be the one doing the review. 8-}

Yes, but Ah has a digitul ES-ELL-ARRRRGGHHHH!!! :knife: Them puppies don't come wit vid-eee-oooooohhhhh modes! :D

Derek

My Fuji SD700 has a video mode. So I think maybe I should be the one doing the review. 8-}

Yes, but Ah has a digitul ES-ELL-ARRRRGGHHHH!!! :knife: Them puppies don't come wit vid-eee-oooooohhhhh modes! :D

Derek
Well, maybe get a real camera. ;)

Is that I've got a line of what appear to be dead pixels running right down the middle of the display. You can see it at my blog page: Derek's Blog Page (http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/). I'm not going to bother posting yet one more place.

This happened about four hours ago after I got done moving some ebooks and some fonts onto the Cybook.:knife:

Derek

Is that I've got a line of what appear to be dead pixels running right down the middle of the display. You can see it at my blog page: Derek's Blog Page (http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/). I'm not going to bother posting yet one more place.

This happened about four hours ago after I got done moving some ebooks and some fonts onto the Cybook.:knife:

Derek
Do you think this is a problem with the Cybook or with VizPlex?

JSWolf,

I'll put my Canon 400D against your piddly-little SD700 any day of the week and twice on Sunday! Of course, *I* get to choose the scenes! And you better be willing to shoot in RAW mode! Ain't gonna tolerate base images in that yucky JPEG!!! :D :D :D

Derek

Oh! Did I mention one of the tests will be shooting Britney from 500 yards? :D Hope you have a good tele!

Well, maybe get a real camera. ;)

Wish I knew... I'm sure others have had the same. I believe I've seen people mention this about some Sonys and Hanlins but I don't rightly recall the posts.

Derek

Do you think this is a problem with the Cybook or with VizPlex?

JSWolf,

I'll put my Canon 400D against your piddly-little SD700 any day of the week and twice on Sunday! Of course, *I* get to choose the scenes! And you better be willing to shoot in RAW mode! Ain't gonna tolerate base images in that yucky JPEG!!! :D :D :D

Derek

Oh! Did I mention one of the tests will be shooting Britney from 500 yards? :D Hope you have a good tele!
I would not want to shoot Britney from 5 feet. I do have taste you know.

The Fuji does 10x zoom and with one of the lenses I have, I believe I can get up to 20x. Without any of this digital zoom crap.

Have to see if I have RAW mode. Not sure of that for real. But to be honest, for shooting eink readers, either camera would do very well.

Wish I knew... I'm sure others have had the same. I believe I've seen people mention this about some Sonys and Hanlins but I don't rightly recall the posts.

Derek
I've never read on MobileRead about a line of dead pixels on teh PRS500, iLiad, or Hanlins. I've read about some odd behaving pixels hear and there, but nothing that bad. Have you tried a reset (if there is such) on the Gen3? or maybe a charge to see if maybe the battery is just a bit low?

Battery's fully charged. Took the extra TrueType fonts off, in case adding them was the problem. If I have to, I'm at a point in my current book where resetting won't be a problem. No, the removal of the TTFs didn't help. Guess it's time to RESET!!! :smack::knife::smack:

And yes, I'm quite sure the SD700 would be up to the task of shooting images. Now if I'm having problems scraping up the $129 for a USB digital video cam, where would I get the money for an SD700? :) Damn Social Security anyway! :D

Derek

I've never read on MobileRead about a line of dead pixels on teh PRS500, iLiad, or Hanlins. I've read about some odd behaving pixels hear and there, but nothing that bad. Have you tried a reset (if there is such) on the Gen3? or maybe a charge to see if maybe the battery is just a bit low?

Battery's fully charged. Took the extra TrueType fonts off, in case adding them was the problem. If I have to, I'm at a point in my current book where resetting won't be a problem. No, the removal of the TTFs didn't help. Guess it's time to RESET!!! :smack::knife::smack:

And yes, I'm quite sure the SD700 would be up to the task of shooting images. Now if I'm having problems scraping up the $129 for a USB digital video cam, where would I get the money for an SD700? :) Damn Social Security anyway! :D

Derek
Do you perhaps know anyone with a camera that can shoot video? The video doesn't have to be wonderful to show page turn speed. Just clear enough to see what's going on.

Ze reset, it has been punched. Ze line, she has not cleared! Ze display, she is broken! :disappoin

Yeah, I found out a neighbor has a JVC MiniDV unit I can borrow. :D

Derek

Do you perhaps know anyone with a camera that can shoot video? The video doesn't have to be wonderful to show page turn speed. Just clear enough to see what's going on.

Ze reset, it has been punched. Ze line, she has not cleared! Ze display, she is broken! :disappoin

Yeah, I found out a neighbor has a JVC MiniDV unit I can borrow. :D

Derek
Does this line of dead pixels impact the page turn speed?

That does suck that you have a line of dead pixels. I'd be interested in what Bookeen has to say and how fast it would be to get a replacement unit to you to do the review. Hopefully one with 0.96 in it.

No, the dead pixel line does not, as far as I can tell, impact page-turn speed. It flashes from page to page just as fast as usual.

Yes, it will be interesting to see how long to get it fixed or replaced. I'm sure it will be interesting to them to see whether it's a hardware or firmware issue - I suspect hardware.

Derek

Does this line of dead pixels impact the page turn speed?

That does suck that you have a line of dead pixels. I'd be interested in what Bookeen has to say and how fast it would be to get a replacement unit to you to do the review. Hopefully one with 0.96 in it.

Can you download any firmware version and give it a flash just to see what's what?

Derek,

Do you have a cell phone with a video camera? It doesn't have to be good video. Don't spend any more money, please.

Derek,

Do you have a cell phone with a video camera? It doesn't have to be good video. Don't spend any more money, please.
Derek is borrowing a video cam. So that is a good thing.

I've got a line of what appear to be dead pixels running right down the middle of the display. You can see it at my blog page: Derek's Blog Page (http://delphidb96.blogspot.com/).

I also note that your image shows the ghost of portrait/landscape menu. Is that what was on-screen prior to the display of the image?

I would suspect that the lone of dead pixels is a hardware issue. Since the e-ink screen is controlled by a matrix like the one used for LCD screens, one row or column has become disconnedted or had a dead component. The control logic for this should be far below the firmware level of the device so I would not suspect a program error.

Not possible at this time as it's not the start of the business week. No open business, no downloading of firmware. :(

But I will see if that helps.

I have reminded myself that this IS an engineering sample and not the final production model. :o

Derek

Can you download any firmware version and give it a flash just to see what's what?

I'm barely fortunate to own a simple TracFone. No fancy video unit for me. Silly me, I waited until just this past summer to even consider getting a cell phone. :disappoin

However, I have the use of a JVC GR-D395U. States it has a 32x optical zoom, the ability to take 2MP stills onto the SD card. I should be okay. Even have a couple of MiniDV 1-hour tapes for it. :)

Derek,

Do you have a cell phone with a video camera? It doesn't have to be good video. Don't spend any more money, please.

Yes. Good catch! This ghosting also shows the contextual menu when used within the ebooks. However, it's not noticeable when you next change the page. With the individual images in the picture directory, seeing a ghost of the menu upon switching from Portrait to Landscape got annoying. And occasionally the same ghosting occurred when switching from one image to another. Happened most often when the contrast ranges between the two images was most different. I'll try to set up a series of images to demonstrate what I mean.

Derek

I also note that your image shows the ghost of portrait/landscape menu. Is that what was on-screen prior to the display of the image?

I would hate to think that was the case, but you may have hit the proverbial nail on the head.

Derek

I would suspect that the lone of dead pixels is a hardware issue. Since the e-ink screen is controlled by a matrix like the one used for LCD screens, one row or column has become disconnedted or had a dead component. The control logic for this should be far below the firmware level of the device so I would not suspect a program error.

Maybe a late reaction to your drop?

The line might be one of the typical eink failures.
There were quite a few Iliad units that had horizontal lines or similar defects int he earlier batches. I haven't heard of any recent problems though. Since Vizplex is fairly new it could be that there will be more problems with the first batch.

Not possible at this time as it's not the start of the business week. No open business, no downloading of firmware. :(

But I will see if that helps.

I have reminded myself that this IS an engineering sample and not the final production model. :o

Derek
Still, I'd expect the screen to be the screen regardless of being a sample or a for-sale unit.

The line might be one of the typical eink failures.
There were quite a few Iliad units that had horizontal lines or similar defects int he earlier batches. I haven't heard of any recent problems though. Since Vizplex is fairly new it could be that there will be more problems with the first batch.

Very true.
I had one of those myself and had to send it back to Irex.
On the bright side, I had it back within a month...

I am really beginning to think that this whole e-book readers thingy is not worth the trouble any more.
Complex devices that do not deliver what they promise, ridiculous prices, riddled with soft- and hard-ware glitches, more file formats than there are books, battery lifespans that can only be measured in picoseconds and companies who consider customers to be a bloody nuisance...bah.

Mind you, it IS monday today...:knife:
[edit] Besides that, I realise I am poluting this thread

Wish I knew... I'm sure others have had the same. I believe I've seen people mention this about some Sonys and Hanlins but I don't rightly recall the posts.

Don't forget you dropped it....

Don't forget you dropped it....

Yep. Silly me. One would *think*, me being one of the SUPERHEROs of NAEB, that I'd not have such clumsiness. Silly 'one', I'm ClumsyMan!!! Capable of wrecking bad guys' plans with a swift stumble and recovery!!! :)

Derek

Wow, maybe you and I, Drops-Stuff-In-The-Toilet Man (http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?p=51085#post51085), should join forces, ClumsyMan! We could call ourselves the Notsosuper Friends! :grin:

Hey Derek, no need to do a video any more. Seems Bookeen already did one using 0.96 and has it on their blog.

Great! That makes sense.

Derek

Hey Derek, no need to do a video any more. Seems Bookeen already did one using 0.96 and has it on their blog.

Wow, maybe you and I, Drops-Stuff-In-The-Toilet Man (http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?p=51085#post51085), should join forces, ClumsyMan! We could call ourselves the Notsosuper Friends! :grin:

Use that wooden box of yours, it'll float long enough to be retrieved... soap hands! :laugh4:
That reader can be real slippery sometimes. I dropped it on my face while reading on my back! Positive, I didn't lose my page like that big HP7 I also dropped. Any one know of an insurance clause for readers who drop books on their faces? :laugh4:

:rofl: Thanks for the chuckle, yvanleterrible! Needed a laugh this gray, rainy morning!

On 09-21-2007, 02:33 AM Harry posted:

"Even if someone did add a backlight you wouldn't be able to see the light. eInk screens are opaque. You could side-light or front-light an eInk display, but you cannot back-light it."
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14005&highlight=backlight
__________________

AAAHHHHHHH! Slaps palm to forehead…. Generation issue!!

I have watched the younger generations play their handheld video games in the dark. Never having seen an e-book reader in person, I simple assumed that I would be able to read the handheld e-book in the car at night while my husband drives or while I’m in bed with the lights off. Now I find out it does not have its own lighting system. Oh dear! Oh dear! :smack:

AAAHHHHHHH! Slaps palm to forehead…. Generation issue!!

I have watched the younger generations play their handheld video games in the dark. Never having seen an e-book reader in person, I simple assumed that I would be able to read the handheld e-book in the car at night while my husband drives or while I’m in bed with the lights off. Now I find out it does not have its own lighting system. Oh dear! Oh dear! :smack:Actually, your assumption is pretty reasonable, the reason it's not correct in this case is that e-ink is a new display type, and its structure can't be back-lit, as HarryT points out, it's opaque.

There are, however reading devices that use LCD screens just like the hand-held games you mentioned, and those reading devices can be back-lit just fine.

It's just that for an e-ink display the light has to come from the front. :shrug:

On 09-21-2007, 02:33 AM Harry posted:

"Even if someone did add a backlight you wouldn't be able to see the light. eInk screens are opaque. You could side-light or front-light an eInk display, but you cannot back-light it."
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14005&highlight=backlight
__________________

AAAHHHHHHH! Slaps palm to forehead…. Generation issue!!

I have watched the younger generations play their handheld video games in the dark. Never having seen an e-book reader in person, I simple assumed that I would be able to read the handheld e-book in the car at night while my husband drives or while I’m in bed with the lights off. Now I find out it does not have its own lighting system. Oh dear! Oh dear! :smack:

Which is where a Lightwedge type of front-lighting system would make sense. Just have it slip onto the case and position over the screen...

Derek

I have watched the younger generations play their handheld video games in the dark. Never having seen an e-book reader in person, I simple assumed that I would be able to read the handheld e-book in the car at night while my husband drives or while I’m in bed with the lights off. Now I find out it does not have its own lighting system. Oh dear! Oh dear! :smack:

You are not the first! You can also check out the threads:
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13726
and
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11650

Still, you do have a few options, even assuming you do not want to carry a UMPC or laptop around. If backlighting does not bother you, take a look at the PDAs still on the market (HP and Palm, for instance), for a good choice of features and reading software. For a dedicated reader with built-in lighting, the only one I know of still being sold and supported is the ETI-2. You can find it at eBookwise (http://www.ebookwise.com/ renamed the eBookwise 1150) and Fillament books (http://www.filamentbooks.com/), and both companies sell content optimized for it.

There are also older PDAs available used, most of which can access a variety of reading software, or older readers, some of which can still get content from companies like Fictionwise (http://fictionwise.com).

Enjoy!

Or if you really like the reflectivity of e-ink you can always buy one of these:

http://www.amazon.com/Mighty-Bright-L-E-D-Light-Purple/dp/B000A86FA6/ref=pd_bbs_10/103-5610449-4064631?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1190834207&sr=8-10

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/51%2B8-XiDyFL._AA280_.jpg

why did you receive a beta unit to test if you're waiting to review it until its developed further? nobody is expecting you to write about the future. just deeply investigate what you have and spread it, thats the reason you got it right...

wh y did you receive a beta unit to test if youre waiting to review it until its developed further? nobody is expecting you to write about the future. just deeply investigate what you have and spread it, thats the reason you got it righ t...I don't know what the posting rules are here, but cross-posting the same question to multiple threads is generally considered bad form.

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?p=100812#post100812

We don't really have hard and fast rules per se, but we do prefer that the same message only get posted in a single place, mainly to avoid having split discussions of the same topic. Gets real confusing for simple folk like me otherwise. :grin:

Anyone wanting to respond to hello's last post here (I'm sure he just wanted to make sure that Derek saw his question), please do it in the thread that MikeF74 linked to -- there's already a discussion going there. :nice:

Weeks after the promised review, we are still in the dark.
And today we have "Official Sony PRS-505 Press Release", "Sony rolls out Sony Reader PRS-505!", "Sony Reader PRS-505 -- MobileRead.com's Conference Call With Sony" one after the other.
I guess Cybook scrambled bad their timing - and I fear that if no review appears in a while I will go happily with the 505...

Alessandro

I guess what is REALLY important now is content.
Sony has it's connect store and the Cybook has mobipocket support. I guess connect is more customer-friendly right now since it offers an iTunes like approach with a central store where you get all there is to get.
Mobipocket might just come out ahead, depending on...the Kindle. If Amazon really puts it's weight behind the Kindle AND goes with mobipocket as a main format (that would make sense, but you never know) then we could be looking at a real upswing for Mobipocket formatted books and also the related infrastructure.

The device as such is inferior to the Sony Reader, especially when it comes to battery life. I have no idea how far they might be able to improve on that, but as of now, the Cybook can't really offer anything special there. Vizplex was an advantage fro the Cybook, but the new Sony Reader also has that, so no advantage there.
The Cybook can read more formats. That's it actually, at least from my perspective.

Weeks after the promised review, we are still in the dark.
And today we have "Official Sony PRS-505 Press Release", "Sony rolls out Sony Reader PRS-505!", "Sony Reader PRS-505 -- MobileRead.com's Conference Call With Sony" one after the other.
I guess Cybook scrambled bad their timing - and I fear that if no review appears in a while I will go happily with the 505...

Alessandro

Alessandro,

Normally, I'd agree with you. I guess why we're holding off is because Bookeen's Cybook Gen3 is not yet in market production. We're working off engineering samples and what we've been told will be included in the final production release of the hardware/firmware is sufficiently advanced from what we have on the engineering samples as to invalidate much of what we could review. If we wrote a review based upon our current version, having the Vizplex display in the Cybook would not be enough to warrant buying one over a Sony PRS-500, much less a PRS-505 or Hanlin V3. But we *ARE* just a month away from the production model - with all it's firmware and hardware features significantly improved over the engineering samples.

Hell, just having the firmware update that was used to create Bookeen's latest video clip would make a significant difference. To give a comparison, it would be like writing a review of Windows 3.11 just before the market release of Windows 95. Oops! :smack:

And that would be misleading to potential customers - and a dis-service to both users and Bookeen.

I'm not saying I couldn't live with the Cybook I've got right now - no updates. I could. I'm saying if I gave it a complete review right now, when Bookeen is so close to having a solid, stable device that can hold it's own in the market, based upon a severely limited pre-production device - that would be misleading.

So I have to wait until the firmware update arrives and I can give a more accurate post.

Derek

The device as such is inferior to the Sony Reader, especially when it comes to battery life. I have no idea how far they might be able to improve on that, but as of now, the Cybook can't really offer anything special there. Vizplex was an advantage fro the Cybook, but the new Sony Reader also has that, so no advantage there.
The Cybook can read more formats. That's it actually, at least from my perspective.

Content, for me personally, is a non-issue: I read things from public domain only, or from the darknet.

Even battery life, as some posts ago I saw discussed, is not so important for me: how many pages do you happen to turn, in a typical reading session?

Most important I find the supported formats: I dont see HTML on Sony, and that puzzles me - possibly I will go html->rtf...


Alessandro

Content, for me personally, is a non-issue: I read things from public domain only, or from the darknet.

Even battery life, as some posts ago I saw discussed, is not so important for me: how many pages do you happen to turn, in a typical reading session?

Most important I find the supported formats: I dont see HTML on Sony, and that puzzles me - possibly I will go html->rtf...


Alessandro

Alessandro,

As I don't have the PRS-505, I can't say how well it will handle HTML. But the Cybook handles HTML ebooks - those that are all-in-one-file - just fine. It does not handle HTML hyperlinks to previous/next files all that well. However, my sample unit is, as I have stated numerous times, at version 0.91 of the firmware and there are supposed to be significant upgrades in how it handles HTML - as well as PDF support, as promised. I'm both frustrated at the current - in my device - firmware and eager to see the updated firmware.

Derek

I guess what is REALLY important now is content.
Sony has it's connect store and the Cybook has mobipocket support. I guess connect is more customer-friendly right now since it offers an iTunes like approach with a central store where you get all there is to get.
Mobipocket might just come out ahead, depending on...the Kindle. If Amazon really puts it's weight behind the Kindle AND goes with mobipocket as a main format (that would make sense, but you never know) then we could be looking at a real upswing for Mobipocket formatted books and also the related infrastructure.

The device as such is inferior to the Sony Reader, especially when it comes to battery life. I have no idea how far they might be able to improve on that, but as of now, the Cybook can't really offer anything special there. Vizplex was an advantage fro the Cybook, but the new Sony Reader also has that, so no advantage there.
The Cybook can read more formats. That's it actually, at least from my perspective.

I would agree that content availability is paramount but there are other features to consider like the nifty dictionary lookup thingy, the differences between how well each of them performs various formatting tasks, the feel of the UI, library management, fonts, and the general flexibility and access of the device. The battery life is actually a non-issue for me. The Cybook's battery life is more than long enough for me. Sony's is longer, but longer than long enough isn't really a big added value. Then I think there are going to be some of us that are going to prefer to throw our dollars behind the NAEB guys if we can get a reader we'll like rather than to Sony or Amazon.

Either way I think a lot of us are waiting to see the Kindle and possibly the upcoming HanLin releases. I wouldn't be jumping at the PRS-505 right now anyway, so a delay in the firmware and review isn't really changing where I stand at the moment. The average consumer might go for the 505 right now since they'll see it on the shelves at their local Circuit City or Best Buy but I don't know how much visibility Bookeen has with them anyway. I think Amazon and the Kindle take the biggest hit from the 505 release. But that said, Bookeen would do well to get this thing out the door by the time the Kindle comes out.

The average consumer might go for the 505 right now since they'll see it on the shelves at their local Circuit City or Best Buy but I don't know how much visibility Bookeen has with them anyway. I think Amazon and the Kindle take the biggest hit from the 505 release. But that said, Bookeen would do well to get this thing out the door by the time the Kindle comes out.You've got your finger on a very important point, there, Alisa. Namely that Sony is the only Reader with any sort of retail presence. However few folks have seen them, the simple fact that they are in stores means a lot of folks have seen them who haven't the least inkling that Bookeen, iRex, HanLin, etc. even exist. It will be very interesting to see what the Kindle does to this market. Amazon is so big, it almost has retail level visibility without having a single brick & mortar store to its name.

Btw, if bookeen began production of its final-version GEN3 only a few days
ago they won't be able to release it in October...

Y It will be very interesting to see what the Kindle does to this market. Amazon is so big, it almost has retail level visibility without having a single brick & mortar store to its name.

In my humble opinion Amazon needs to start making some buzz about the Kindle. They have great visibility but they're not using it. I don't think most people have heard a single word about the upcoming launch. It would certainly make them think twice about the 505. Sony was smart to get it into the stores before the Kindle launch. They're going to have a much harder time luring people to commit to the Connect store if Amazon offers more titles. But if Sony does some good marketing right now and manages to get a lot of the buying public that may be interested in trying ebooks, those customers are likely not going to turn around and buy a Kindle. I'm hoping they'll realize after slugging it out for awhile that they'll both move more books if they loosen up on the formats.

Btw, if bookeen began production of its final-version GEN3 only a few days
ago they won't be able to release it in October...

Very true, but if they can present enough of a product to convince people to wait for them, they have some hope.

In my humble opinion Amazon needs to start making some buzz about the Kindle. They have great visibility but they're not using it. I don't think most people have heard a single word about the upcoming launch.

Then again, since Amazon doesn't have a store presence, it might be to their advantage to let Sony legitimize the whole e-book reader concept for the mainstream market and get the chatter going. Then Amazon only has to sell its own unit by comparison. It no longer has to sell both the concept and the unit.

Either way, Amazon is behaving rather oddly -- it's supposed to be 13 days til their launch and all we've heard is the launch date. :headscratch:

I would love to see Amazon and Sony make a whole lot of noise about e-books, nothing like a good clash of the titans to draw attention. :D

Then again, since Amazon doesn't have a store presence, it might be to their advantage to let Sony legitimize the whole e-book reader concept for the mainstream market and get the chatter going. Then Amazon only has to sell its own unit by comparison. It no longer has to sell both the concept and the unit.

I do think a rising tide will lift all boats ultimately but if they're not going to support each other's formats then the choice of which reader is also a choice for many of which bookstore. That's the real revenue generator. I would imagine there is little or no profit on the readers even though it's a fairly big purchase for most consumers. We focus a lot on the choice of readers and many of us here are buying books without the DRM or downloading public domain works so that choice is less constricting. The consumer that I'm betting is the focus of their model is buying books at their bookstore and if they buy a 505 that bookstore is not Amazon.

Either way, Amazon is behaving rather oddly -- it's supposed to be 13 days til their launch and all we've heard is the launch date. :headscratch:

I would love to see Amazon and Sony make a whole lot of noise about e-books, nothing like a good clash of the titans to draw attention. :D

And we've heard about it because we're interested in ebooks. We're actively seeking out news. I don't think the average Amazon customer is even aware that this is coming.

Either way, Amazon is behaving rather oddly -- it's supposed to be 13 days til their launch and all we've heard is the launch date. :headscratch:

I would love to see Amazon and Sony make a whole lot of noise about e-books, nothing like a good clash of the titans to draw attention. :D

Was that even a confirmed date? I thought that was just a very good rumor.

A point, that was just a very good rumor: http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13756

October came from the NY Times, so it's probably reliable. :shrug:

{snip}
I would love to see Amazon and Sony make a whole lot of noise about e-books, nothing like a good clash of the titans to draw attention. :D

The problem with that is that this market doesn't seem to have any real titans.
It seems to be more a matter of garden gnomes fighting over a small and rather smelly pond.
At this moment ebook readers are devices for gadget enthousiasts, hobbying programmers who need a challenge, a handfull of real ebook reading fanatics and a few executives who want impress their secretaries.

The titans will be clashing over an obscure device that more than 99% of your normal Joe's just shrug about and then forget because in their view reading an ebook means loading, formatting, converting, typesetting, swearing, startup, buttons, more swearing, waiting, charging, button pushing and scrolling, manual reading, updating, still even more swearing, calling repair centers, black/white only, huge initial costs, breaking nails and swearing.
"Right...get me my Donald Duck comic and stick that ebook stuff where the sun don't shine..."

No amount of noise is going to make a difference to that any time soon.

Thanks for that - it made me laugh.

I have only had my Reader for a couple of weeks but have managed to keep things quite simple and straightforward. I have loaded a number of Sony's initial 'free classics' offer and a couple of the texts kindly downloaded onto this site. The operation of the Reader itself is also easy - and a pleasure to use. I am baffled by much of the techno chatter, but looking forward to the 'fix' which enables my Reader to make me a cup of tea in the morning!

My one concern is the lack of warranty - being in the UK

At this moment ebook readers are devices for gadget enthousiasts, hobbying programmers who need a challenge, a handfull of real ebook reading fanatics and a few executives who want impress their secretaries.At this moment, that is more or less true. However, Sony and Amazon are clearly trying to change that. And while the world of e-books may presently be accurately described as a small, smelly pond, and Sony and Amazon are only slightly invested in the area relative to the rest of their endeavors, Sony and Amazon are both names that get notice from the average Joe. If those two start slugging it out over anything, even in a gnome-like fashion, people are likely to notice -- if only because they're such un-likely adversaries. :shrug:

That's what I'm thinking, anyway.

At this moment, that is more or less true. However, Sony and Amazon are clearly trying to change that. And while the world of e-books may presently be accurately described as a small, smelly pond, and Sony and Amazon are only slightly invested in the area relative to the rest of their endeavors, Sony and Amazon are both names that get notice from the average Joe. If those two start slugging it out over anything, even in a gnome-like fashion, people are likely to notice -- if only because they're such un-likely adversaries. :shrug:

That's what I'm thinking, anyway.

Let's not forget the recent Harlequin news, either. If they're successful, that could really change the demographics of the market.

Let's not forget the recent Harlequin news, either. If they're successful, that could really change the demographics of the market.

From your lips to God's ears!:pray:

The companies responsible for eink and flexible screens are doing a good job with their prototype showings. They feature less intensive simple designs, in a certain way it's more a populist approach. They would have to be because their profit margins would depend more on units sold than exclusivity markets.

The companies responsible for eink and flexible screens are doing a good job with their prototype showings.

We have been seeing those roll-up and/or a4 sized, easy-as-taking-a-leak prototypes for a few years now.
Newspapers absolutely love them whenever there is no real news around.
A nice picture with the ever so popular catchy title "Paper to disappear soon".
Usualy there's a few exclamation marks in the article itself.
Sometimes there is a labcoat type of chappie in the picture as well.
...he is smiling.

They feature less intensive simple designs, in a certain way it's more a populist approach. They would have to be because their profit margins would depend more on units sold than exclusivity markets.

They are like the cars you get on big motorshows, with an awfully high "O wow! I want to get me one of those!!" effect.
(There's the exclamation marks again, see?)
They are sleek, they are fast, cost effective, have two exhaust pipes and in of those you absolutely positively know you'll get the chicks.
They are also a con.

Study models they are called and one of the highly paid executives from the motorcompany itself is going to ride in them and he'll have one arm hanging loosely out of the window, the other arm around a supermodel of a very different kind.
The bastard!

The real model that will be coming out the next year has 6 cupholders, enough room for three kids and a dog, it has an adjustable ashtray and a cd-player as an optional extra.
It is also boring as hell and is mainly bought by secretaries who buy the thing because "it looks so cute in its standard pink colour and its ever so cheap".
You wouldn't want to be found dead in any one of them.

My point is ( I do tend to get lost in my own head, sorry) that even the big companies making ebookreaders mainly seem to do so as a study for integrating epaper in the devices that DO sell, like mobile phones.
We, the buyers take care of a little of the development cost.

Onwards towards colour epaper!!!
(stupid exclamation marks...)

We have been seeing those roll-up and/or a4 sized, easy-as-taking-a-leak prototypes for a few years now.
Newspapers absolutely love them whenever there is no real news around.
A nice picture with the ever so popular catchy title "Paper to disappear soon".
Usualy there's a few exclamation marks in the article itself.
Sometimes there is a labcoat type of chappie in the picture as well.
...he is smiling.



They are like the cars you get on big motorshows, with an awfully high "O wow! I want to get me one of those!!" effect.
(There's the exclamation marks again, see?)
They are sleek, they are fast, cost effective, have two exhaust pipes and in of those you absolutely positively know you'll get the chicks.
They are also a con.

Study models they are called and one of the highly paid executives from the motorcompany itself is going to ride in them and he'll have one arm hanging loosely out of the window, the other arm around a supermodel of a very different kind.
The bastard!

The real model that will be coming out the next year has 6 cupholders, enough room for three kids and a dog, it has an adjustable ashtray and a cd-player as an optional extra.
It is also boring as hell and is mainly bought by secretaries who buy the thing because "it looks so cute in its standard pink colour and its ever so cheap".
You wouldn't want to be found dead in any one of them.

My point is ( I do tend to get lost in my own head, sorry) that even the big companies making ebookreaders mainly seem to do so as a study for integrating epaper in the devices that DO sell, like mobile phones.
We, the buyers take care of a little of the development cost.

Onwards towards colour epaper!!!
(stupid exclamation marks...)

What!!! Don't ever downgrade exclamation points in front of me again!!?!! :laugh4:

What I mean is that a simple pure design (without cupholders :grin:) means no fuss, no bells and whistles, even if the thing don't work now!!! Simplicity is a sign of 'not expensive' compared to 'tons of extras'. This is a good approach if you want to sell to Mr. Nocash, and a good way to bring a product to popularity. Take a look at the flexible display, it reminds me of a document protector, is that the look of something expensive? Simple is sold !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laugh4: Images like that say 'Hey that's fantastic I can afford it because it looks ordinary'
S'all!!! Real simple!!!

No amount of noise is going to make a difference to that any time soon.

Depends on how would you define soon.

Let's not forget that the rate at which technology becomes culture (the rate at which we incorporate gadgeds in a way that changes our life) is accelerating.

The examples are clear: cell phones, from luxury to commodity in 12 years and of course mp3 players (more precisely ipods), from nerds to Paris Hilton in 5 years. :p

It wouldn't take that much to change the market. going back to the ipod, the ipod hasn't been the end of the recording industry or the CD, that is not the point. The point is, the revolution is we know have access to milions of songs trough itunes. (I say it, even if I still hate DRM).

It is my understanding that you don't have to be a geek to purchase and read a book at the Connect store. The Amazon reader will be just as easy.

Release a good reader in the $ 100-200 range. Let publisher sign agreements with Amazon, Sony and bookeen to include coupons for discounted ebooks or readers in pbooks. (Amazon could easily do that).

Then content explosion will follow and the market will have changed, even if consumers habits will be slower to adapt.

My point is: do you really believe ituns song sales could exclusively justify the market shhift and the digital content explosion in the music industry?

Maybe in the end a noise and hype do play a role.

I for one am hopeful, hardware is almost ready, content and market are not that difficult.
(I say it and I have an iLiad.... boy am I hope-fool)